IXEG For X-Plane 12 status.

[tkyler]

Hello all.   Those who have followed know that the IXEG 737 develoment has been stagnant for a long time while I've worked on my MU-2 project and stabilize it after the release.  That stabilization phase is nearly done.  XP12 is imminent and I'll be porting the MU2 to XP12 beginning next week...and it should not be terribly long (I hope).  After that,  the 733 will move back into rotation as the primary focus of development with the port to v12 being the first priority.  The IXEG is minimally operable in V12, but that's all we can say.  We obviously had to make it baseline flyable in order to test/develop it with all the XP12 changes, which have yet to be addressed.  As such, our official position for those who wish to try the V11 IXEG in V12 is "VFR joyriding only".   I expect we'll  set up a 'volunteer forum' where folks can give feedback as to their V12 observations as its better to have more eyes on this stuff; however, we request that nobody report any shortcomings of the V11 733 in V12.  We are keenly aware of a lot of things that have to be changed....so we'll want to wait until we believe we've caught all we can find before other folks chime in; otherwise we'll end up with a massive stack of the same reports. 

So, certainly keep XP11 around if you wish to fly the IXEG seriously until we get it ported over. I've always kept "old version / new versions" side by side on my computer for these transitions.  Long-time XP users know that after a major release to X-Plane, there is an inevitable debug period that goes on for some time, though many other devs have begun already, we're behind. ....but nice to have the process underway.....Below screenshot shows what the cockpit looks like in V12 daytime.

-TomK

Edited September 5, 2022 by tkyler

[Pils]

Thanks for the update! Really looking forward to the next releases, the IXEG 737 is one of my personal favourites.

With the help of some of your fellow custom FMS developers, we have been curating a list of instrument procedures that are “challenging” in some way or another for GPS navigators to follow correctly. I think you would find it a useful reference if you plan to delve deep into that part of the product. I am also open to any additions you might find!

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MubloGDNCNSqmfNcQe5PmnvsAUF_FK8zYhmuSHa-UUw/edit?usp=sharing

Good luck with the ongoing development!

[tkyler]

Thx Pils, that's a good list, will definitely give those procedures a try..

[avantime]

Please for god's sake make it a paid upgrade, if only to get you guys to be more financially motivated in your work. The IXEG has been languishing for years, and I've seen addons from other developers being released at an unfinished state, and those devs lose interest as sales slow to a trickle.

I loved the 737 Classic and I would love to throw money at you guys if I can get a fully featured (i.e. proper VNAV and holding), fully functioning addon. I also want the -400 and -500 if you want to make paid extensions as well, like what PMDG is doing.

Also some Brunner force feedback yoke support would be nice.....

[Dozo]

Thanks for the update. Looking forward to fly this 737 in XP12!

[MAFAv8r]

Looking forward to it,as the IXEG 737 was my favourite from way back, and I finally have a good enough system for Xplane 12 to fly maxed out

[Revd]

that is excellent news

 

[beHaind]

On 9/7/2022 at 2:17 AM, avantime said:

Please for god's sake make it a paid upgrade, if only to get you guys to be more financially motivated in your work.

+1

[Dozo]

On 9/7/2022 at 2:17 AM, avantime said:

Please for god's sake make it a paid upgrade, if only to get you guys to be more financially motivated in your work.

I wouldn't mind paying an upgrade fee either, especially if it would mean we could fly it in XP12 sooner

In any case, it'd be happy to help in testing.

[Almdudler]

just read the related news on https://www.thresholdx.net/news/ixxp12

and i am fully alligned with the statement in the lower forum section by a guy called "pilotoloco".

Other than what i read over here, i don't think developping is about financials. That is so silly proposing.

Creators lik Tom Kyler trigger by the creation process, hard to understand for users that keep yellling for more and more

without having an understanding of the sheer time consuming development process.

products like the 733 are accompanying Tom's life like his own child, something he gave to the world as a fulfilment of talented output 

that is deep inside a personality. Only creative people share this understanding of life.

I wished Tom would crack the vertical world with an equally well done quality helicopter to become a reference in x-plane.

As much as the 737 distinguished from anything else in the fixed wing folder, i personally would not need more from x-plane

than having a tyler rotorcraft aside. Tom, if you ever considered vertical, please share your thoughts.

 

 

[ThorBrasil]

On 9/17/2022 at 5:36 AM, Dozo said:

I wouldn't mind paying an upgrade fee either, especially if it would mean we could fly it in XP12 sooner

In any case, it'd be happy to help in testing.

The upgrade cannot be billed. It has been many years since IXEG has received an update.

[Dozo]

6 hours ago, Almdudler said:

Other than what i read over here, i don't think developping is about financials. That is so silly proposing.

Developers need to eat too and in this world we live in, money dictates a lot of stuff (unfortunately). Like priorities, which differ for all of us. Like, I would like the 733 to fly in XP12, you'd rather have a helicopter in XP12. That's all fine ofcourse, we'll see what happens

[Dozo]

1 hour ago, ThorBrasil said:

The upgrade cannot be billed. It has been many years since IXEG has received an update.

You bought an XP11 plane, you can't expect developers to continue to support new versions of the sim till eternity. I do understand what you're saying about updates, but it will be like you describe anyway, since the 733 upgrade to XP12 was already announced as free.

[ThorBrasil]

58 minutes ago, Dozo said:

Developers need to eat too and in this world we live in, money dictates a lot of stuff (unfortunately). Like priorities, which differ for all of us. Like, I would like the 733 to fly in XP12, you'd rather have a helicopter in XP12. That's all fine ofcourse, we'll see what happens

 

55 minutes ago, Dozo said:

You bought an XP11 plane, you can't expect developers to continue to support new versions of the sim till eternity. I do understand what you're saying about updates, but it will be like you describe anyway, since the 733 upgrade to XP12 was already announced as free.

The IXEG 737 was practically abandoned in X-Plane 11. not even the doors open. not to mention other things. It's not fair to charge for an upgrade to X-Plane 12 as it's pretty much the same simulator with graphical improvements. So far I haven't seen a developer charging for updating their modules.

[Pils]

8 minutes ago, ThorBrasil said:

So far I haven't seen a developer charging for updating their modules.

There are at least 3 major ones I can think of just off the top of my head. Lucky for us consumers several of the X-Aviation developers have decided otherwise. But IXEG should feel free to decide for themselves. At least the 737 has already been supported for multiple versions of the sim for those who bought early in its life.

[mjrhealth]

4 hours ago, ThorBrasil said:

pretty much the same simulator with graphical improvements

I assume you havnt watched all the interviews, The biggest thing is lighting and every plane addon will need that upgraded, Not so simple, than there is the N1 N2 on jets, thats changes an engine rewrite. Would you upgrade someone 20 year old car for free. Happy at any price.

[tkyler]

On 9/18/2022 at 1:57 PM, ThorBrasil said:

So far I haven't seen a developer charging for updating their modules.

...and for updating the 'last working XP11 version to similar behavior in XP12?....neither will we....we've said it many times and this is not in debate.   It is a bit more of a process because XP12 has changed quite a bit with regards to engine and systems, which  means we have to audit everything and surgicaly remove code that clashes with XP12 functionality...and we put in a LOT of customization.

As far as a discussion of charging a fee relative to "when its finished".,  too subjective......I have enough statistical evidence that says to me that a lot of folks have really enjoyed the 737 for a lot longer than the price of a 2 hour anniversary dinner...(for newlyweds anyhow).  To those who would argue about 'unsimulated things',   all I'm going to say is Pffff.   I've been a software 'consumer' for over 40 years, and not casually, I make my living from using software, 100s of titles over the years....and this stuff is always evolving, always changing...LOTS of software is missing things.  I use what I can, enjoy the good parts, don't buy what I don't like and everybody has the same choice here...we're not hiding anything.  I could easily argue that a lot of products lack "immersion", realistic lighting....or decent sounds.  The flight sim dev community isn't like it was.  Its more saturated, the bar is higher and the detail we have to put in is a heck of a lot more than PMDG had to in its early days when it had a monopoly on the airliner market.

So what would we charge for?   ...I can't say, but its true we have no incentive to keep on working for free in perpetuity.   Have you noticed how everything is moving to the subscription model?  There's a reason for that...and guess what,  I have at least 8 software subscriptions...every month/quarter....how would you guys like that? (hint, you wouldn't).  If we charge for any update, its fair to say that it would have to justify the deliverable for a majority of customers (cause it'll never be all).  Probably....thinking off the top of my head...., includes more variants, the FMS more complete, animated everything, more robust failure interactions, etc...stuff like that.  AND it wouldn't be a full price upgrade either,  I never like that idea.

So...feel free to discuss as much as you like, but I just wanted to throw out some of my thoughts for folks who haven't gotten to know me over the years through other posts.

TK

 

Edited September 21, 2022 by tkyler

[Pils]

1 hour ago, tkyler said:

how would you guys like that?

In general, if it means the difference between an indie developer continually investing in their products or not, I would definitely take the subscription. But it seems I may be in the minority there.

[ThorBrasil]

2 hours ago, tkyler said:

...and for updating the 'last working XP11 version to similar behavior in XP12?....neither will we....we've said it many times and this is not in debate.   It is a bit more of a process because XP12 has changed quite a bit with regards to engine and systems, which  means we have to audit everything and surgicaly remove code that clashes with XP12 functionality...and we put in a LOT of customization.

As far as a discussion of charging a fee relative to "when its finished".,  too subjective......I have enough statistical evidence that says to me that a lot of folks have really enjoyed the 737 for a lot longer than the price of a 2 hour anniversary dinner...(for newlyweds anyhow).  To those who would argue about 'unsimulated things',   all I'm going to say is Pffff.   I've been a software 'consumer' for over 40 years, and not casually, I make my living from using software, 100s of titles over the years....and this stuff is always evolving, always changing...LOTS of software is missing things.  I use what I can, enjoy the good parts, don't buy what I don't like and everybody has the same choice here...we're not hiding anything.  I could easily argue that a lot of products lack "immersion", realistic lighting....or decent sounds.  The flight sim dev community isn't like it was.  Its more saturated, the bar is higher and the detail we have to put in is a heck of a lot more than PMDG had to in its early days when it had a monopoly on the airliner market.

So what would we charge for?   ...I can't say, but its true we have no incentive to keep on working for free in perpetuity.   Have you noticed how everything is moving to the subscription model?  There's a reason for that...and guess what,  I have at least 8 software subscriptions...every month/quarter....how would you guys like that? (hint, you wouldn't).  If we charge for any update, its fair to say that it would have to justify the deliverable for a majority of customers (cause it'll never be all).  Probably....thinking off the top of my head...., includes more variants, the FMS more complete, animated everything, more robust failure interactions, etc...stuff like that.  AND it wouldn't be a full price upgrade either,  I never like that idea.

So...feel free to discuss as much as you like, but I just wanted to throw out some of my thoughts for folks who haven't gotten to know me over the years through other posts.

TK

 

I do not agree to pay for an upgrade because during the lifetime of XP11 the IXEG 737 was abandoned. Even the doors of the aircraft do not open to this day. If it was a product that had received a lot of updates in the XP11 period I wouldn't bother paying for an XP12 upgrade. The right thing would be to upgrade the 737-300 free of charge and then sell the 400 and 500 versions as DLC. Or raise the value of the 737 package for new buyers with the 400 and 500 variants. I don't want to fight. I just want to demonstrate my point of view. I wish you success.

[Cameron]

1 hour ago, ThorBrasil said:

Even the doors of the aircraft do not open to this day.

If this is such a huge focus for you (you've mentioned doors multiple times now), you were never really the target customer for IXEG anyhow. Hate to say that, but it's true.

[Iain]

I still fly the -300, have hundreds of hours on it, it is still the best feeling aircraft to fly, way better than anything MSFS has to offer, better feeling than Zibo and is a nice challenge with it's limitations.  Really enjoy the Felis 747-200 for the same reasons, it is completely manual VNAV and INS system, IXEG is like a Tesla compared to that dinosaur!

More than willing to pay for an upgrade to XP12, of course we have waited a long time for an upgrade for XP11, but the developers have been very transparent with the reasons for it not happening, which is totally acceptable.  If it was to happen for XP12 then that would be a stroke of fortune and good timing, since the team have found some time to put development work into it.

 

[tkyler]

The XP12 "compatibility" work is underway FYI.  First order of business is to get it flying as it does now in XP11, and then to begin improvements.

-TomK

Edited November 13, 2022 by tkyler

[Litjan]

And initial testing is promising...

 

[PEPcessna]

Awesome News, do the engine start in a realistic manner? I have notice with a lot of other addons in XP12 the N2 rotation on start up is ridiculously quick about 5 seconds before it reaches 40% N2. It is obviously an issue with XP12 however I am just abit curious if this issue exists with the 733 in XP12 or if thats something that will be sorted down the line? 

[Litjan]

The engines start fine :-)