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Below are the e mail exchanges between x aviation and myself .
 
This is my position .
 
I believed that we needed the manual that was being sold on their site .
 
What I didn`t know because it was not being made transparent was that there are adequate IMHO tutorials and video`s buried in the x plane folders and here`s how to find them :
 
open the x plane folders
 
aircraft
 
X-Aviation
 
IXEG 737 Classic
 
Documentation
 
There you will find
 
4 quick start Guides
 
5 tutorials
 
and other stuff
 
if you open 5 tutorials you will find 4 more tutorials --- if for instance you open the basic FMS and navigation file scroll down to Resources and there is a link to the buried / hidden video tutorial which you follow using the printed instructions on the page and Jan will even make references to the correct pages in the video ---- couldn`t be easier could it --- forgive me if I am wrong but why but the downloadable manual when most of it is here to be found quite easily .
 
Because of the position taken by X-Aviation I will think twice and definitely more carefully before I ever buy anything from them again .
 
I would also advise you all to first of all try out the freeware 737 which may be out this weekend --- I think it is an NG with glass cockpit --- there is a fantastic video on Youtube showing this AC during 2 flights and I was very very impressed --- don`t much like glass cockpits --- I was trained RW on Cessnas and Pipers and a Beech Duchess Twin and an Aztec Twin --- all steam gauges --- no glass in site --- I believe that you need to buy an FMC sperately but this is only $ 20.00 I think .
 
Well --- they have definitely alienated me from their customer base . Shame because without all of the glitches and bugs I am sure that the 737 will be an absolute winner for a lot of people ---- but like I have said ---- possible you won`t need the manual --- and can anyone tell us if this manual is specific to the model of 737 please ?
 
Now I have seen where all of the tutorials and documentation are hidden I no longer think that the 737 was not good value for money --- but I`ll say it again --- I believe that the tutorial is a waste of money --- pity for Mike Ray because he writes such fantastic books/manuals/tutorials and I had a great time chatting with him when he was at the Flight Sim show many years ago in Blackpool .
 
Hi Paul,
 
As per the terms on our website, we do not offer refunds on downloaded goods.
 
I was in the midst of seeing if we could work out an upgrade cost for you to convert this to the coil bound book, but given your latest message I will cancel this request now.
 
Best Regards, 
Cameron
 
On Fri, Apr 29, 2016 at 4:10 AM -0700, "PAUL WOODS" <paulwoods123@btinternet.com> wrote: 
 
Sorry but I now am quite serious about a refund for the manual ---- now I find that we don`t need the manual because all of what we need is in a documents folder where there are also " hidden " tutorials --- why are they " hidden " ----- there was absolutely no need to buy the manual -- it is not even specific to this AC so I am told ------ I really should be asking for a refund for the 737 also because they have released full of bugs ---- small bugs we can accept but the bugs are substantial and quite a few are related to the FMC which takes away one of the reasons for flying this AC on line --- i will keep the 737 because I like the steam gauges but I will just use it now for fun flying and I`ll now wait for release of the freeware 737 and probably use this for my on-line flying activities ------ please refund me for the manual --- NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE !!
Now I know where to find the tutorials I won`t be buying a manual from Mike Ray --- I already have two of his that I bought directly from him at the Blackpool Flight Sim show many years ago . 
 
Kind regards
 
Paul Woods 
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You are aware that there is a link to these videos in the manuals that are delivered with this product, right? Just click on the youtube link on the first page of the documents and you will be redirected to the video on the IXEG channel. I have no idea why You are criticizing a lack of transparency when these videos are available for all customers...just the ability to read correctly is an advantage ;)

Gesendet von iPhone mit Tapatalk

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Hi Paul,

I'm sorry you feel dissatisfied. There has been no hidden agenda here. On the IXEG 737 product page we are quite clear with the following:

Documentation
  • Includes guide for interfacing, minimal pilot handbook, and six comprehensive tutorial guides with matching tutorial videos

It's quite transparent, and to this point, you are the only customer of thousands to complain.

15 minutes ago, ptwparkinson said:

Because of the position taken by X-Aviation I will think twice and definitely more carefully before I ever buy anything from them again .

Sadly, I think I can recall such wording from you multiple times in the past years. Having looked at your support history, you seem to always "shoot from the hip" before giving anyone an opportunity to reply to you. Always...mad, or something.

15 minutes ago, ptwparkinson said:

and can anyone tell us if this manual is specific to the model of 737 please ?

Yes, it is.

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7 minutes ago, Rodeo said:

There's a hard copy of that pilot's handbook available? Where can I get it please

We're in the process of making this available. I'll update you ASAP...shouldn't be very long at all, and if you've purchased the PDF we can give you a path to upgrade. :)

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Shooting from the hip ------ yes I was trained to do just that at one point of my life ---- and what is wrong with healthy exchanges of opinion in any case ---- if you are talking about my complaints about the 777 --- I had every right to complain --- it was my money that was spent --- i have tried to be as polite as possible --- going back to shooting from the hip ---- it is partially my way of defence when I think that I have been mistreated or if someone is coming at me --- although in this case I don`t think that I was shooting from the hip ---- I really really do not take too kindly to being called mad ----- I have been round the block quite a few times and managed to survive with my sanity intact ---- you still have the distance to go --- and if Third World War does strike ( and I hope that it does not ) you will then probably find out for yourself what can potentially send someone stark bonking mad --- but no --- I came through my trails and tribulations and no I am not mad in any way ---- just an ordinary bloke on the verge of something that may transpire as truly breath taking and that is when I will probably burrow underground and have 3 or 4 different simulators built and if anyone wishes to call me mad for staying down there flying all day and listening to the icelandic rock band Kaleo at volume 11 ---- am I bovvered ----- but if none of this happens and my plans fall through I`ll just soldier on --- but it won`t drive me mad --- I`ll have a search through my history now to see what other mischief I have been up to !!!!

And as for Fchiari ---- you don`t know me --- so you have no idea what my abilities are ---- yes I can read and write for your information ---- you have no idea why I am being critical ------ what more can I say !!!

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Hi Cameron,

I bought the B737 manual in pdf format on day 1 or 2. It's a good manual. My only beef is every time I open the file, it requires a numeric input - a nuisance.

I would definitely like to upgrade to the hard copy. Please advise when it is ready.

Thanks for all the hard work.

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1 hour ago, jcjimmy said:

Hi Cameron,

I bought the B737 manual in pdf format on day 1 or 2. It's a good manual. My only beef is every time I open the file, it requires a numeric input - a nuisance.

I would definitely like to upgrade to the hard copy. Please advise when it is ready.

Thanks for all the hard work.

Quick question- the PDF requires unlocking every time it is opened? I normally read my manuals from my iPad. Is that supported?

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20 hours ago, ptwparkinson said:

Shooting from the hip ------ yes I was trained to do just that at one point of my life ---- and what is wrong with healthy exchanges of opinion in any case ---- if you are talking about my complaints about the 777 --- I had every right to complain --- it was my money that was spent --- i have tried to be as polite as possible --- going back to shooting from the hip ---- it is partially my way of defence when I think that I have been mistreated or if someone is coming at me --- although in this case I don`t think that I was shooting from the hip ---- I really really do not take too kindly to being called mad ----- I have been round the block quite a few times and managed to survive with my sanity intact ---- you still have the distance to go --- and if Third World War does strike ( and I hope that it does not ) you will then probably find out for yourself what can potentially send someone stark bonking mad --- but no --- I came through my trails and tribulations and no I am not mad in any way ---- just an ordinary bloke on the verge of something that may transpire as truly breath taking and that is when I will probably burrow underground and have 3 or 4 different simulators built and if anyone wishes to call me mad for staying down there flying all day and listening to the icelandic rock band Kaleo at volume 11 ---- am I bovvered ----- but if none of this happens and my plans fall through I`ll just soldier on --- but it won`t drive me mad --- I`ll have a search through my history now to see what other mischief I have been up to !!!!

And as for Fchiari ---- you don`t know me --- so you have no idea what my abilities are ---- yes I can read and write for your information ---- you have no idea why I am being critical ------ what more can I say !!!

Mistreated.........someone coming at me.......third world war.......burrow underground?  :lol::blink::rolleyes:

 

I'm going to start a crowd funding to get this guy his money back......LOL!!!!

Tim

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Allow me to explain --- you must not worry too much about the expression burrowing underground - It is my ambition to live in a property with a big basement and install 3 or 4 flight simulators -- so you won t need counselling sessions trying to work out what I meant about burrowing underground 

someone coming at me --- yes I have experienced this in many different ways --- apart from military experiences I got involved in a huge conspiracy -- my phones were being monitored -- tracking devices were planted on my car --- 187 avi files were deleted from my hard drive to slow down what we were doing either by satellite or by someone breaking into my office when I was working at Pinewood Studios --- this is not conspiracy theory --- these things happened to me -- it is a long time ago but it may still be relevant because we are about to potentially make a huge breakthrough which may possibly change everything for a lot of people

Third World War -- yes it has already been planned and it is one of their options -- bit of common sense would explain why !

mistreated --- yes -- I wasn't t even offered a discount -- they took my money for something that I don t actually want

psych evaluation -- you obviously don t know me and you have no idea what I have been through and you don t need to know nor do I need to tell you -- I am just waiting for God now because of my age and trying to leave some security behind for my wife and children

I was a RW pilot 600 plus hours PPL , IMC RATING , NIGHT RATING , TWIN RATING , 6 hours on gliders , 31 parachute drops -- can no longer afford to fly so X plane helps fill the gap and I just wish that I had more time for flying on line

I will say again --- this 737 is phenomenal -- my favourite AC ever was Derek Maltbys BAC 111 in fs but this 737 can easily take its place --- I went to work for the BBC for 6 months in southern Spain and went both ways on numerous occasions in the jump seat of a BAC 111 --- can t be done now because of 9/11 -- I worked on Bergerac for 2 years and flew jump seats quite often and did most of my PPL on Jersey --- flew twice down the Challenger landing strip in Florida in the 80 s ----- I was instucted by ATC to stay above 500 ft and to stay on the right of the centreline - you would t get anywhere near close to a place like that now

psych evaluation --- we lost our father in a house fire in 1999 and our mother to cancer 4 years later , brought on by the shock --- still have my moments when I think about this but my sanity is very much still intact !!!!

what may send me insane is what the Zionist bankers are doing to us all !!!! They are out for total control !!!

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See ... I am not imagining anything ..... This is the post that made me believe that the video tutorials etc were " hidden " and I am still looking for the post which said that manual was not specific to this 737 so that you know I am not hallucinating and making things up  --- I am referring to what other people have posted. And as I have said --- they are very very good tutorials !!

Jan did a lot of great tutorials. You can read the manuals of the plane while he is performing these tutorials on Youtube for you. But these are hidden videos. You need to go to your X-Plane 10\Aircraft\X-Aviation\IXEG 737 Classic\Documentation folder and open the Qucik-Start-Guides or Tutorials folder. Inside there are some PDF-files where at each beginning is a hidden youtube link. With these links you get to the Video-Tutorials. Jan did one Tutorial per PDF-File so you get there 4 Tutorial-Videos and 2 Quick-Start-Videos in wich Jan performs all what is described in these PDF-Files.

So you are able to read the PDFs while following Jans Videos. Great isn't it?

Philip

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Usually, individuals who spend substantial amounts of money on flight simulator add-ons are (rightfully) offended when the developers do NOT include sufficient documentation or tutorials with their products.

You are the first person I have ever seen who has taken offense because the developers (IXEG) DID include ample documentation and video tutorials. To say that your complaint makes absolutely no sense is an understatement.

The documentation is not "hidden", it is right in the Documents sub folder, exactly where one would expect to find it. It is the first folder I look for when I install any new add-on for XP.

As for Mike Ray's book - I see nothing on the X-Aviation product page for the IXEG 737 that implies that the book is "required". It is simply offered as a supplement for those who may want additional information about the entire 737 Classic series. (And, at a substantial discount over the normal cost of the book in printed form I might add).

Though Mike has written many excellent books specifically targeted at non-pilot flight simmers, his 737 Classic book was published years before the IXEG add-on was created. This particular edition was written for real-world pilots transitioning to the 737, though there is much that is directly applicable a highly-accurate simulation of the aircraft. Since you mention that you are well aware of Mike's work, and even say you have met him in person, what is your issue?

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See ... I am not imagining anything ..... This is the post that made me believe that the video tutorials etc were " hidden " and I am still looking for the post which said that manual was not specific to this 737...

The cover of Mike Ray's manual is shown on the X-Aviation web site, where it is offered as a companion product to the IXEG 737. Even a cursory reading of that cover photo should make it clear that it was written as a check ride prep book for r/w 737 pilots.

The book has been in print for probably 15 years (or more.)

It IS directly applicable to the IXEG aircraft to the degree that the simulation accurately emulates a real 737-300 in many regards, and it is written in Mike's excellent style, which makes highly complex systems and flying techniques easy to understand - for simmers AND real world pilots.

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There was another post I just found in X plane forums but couldn't paste - anyway it was the post that I read saying that manual was not specific to this AC -- will copy and post later just for the record .

Another post from the X aviation team defending their sale of this Mike Ray manual by saying they had included it for sale because they just happened to get a discount for us -- so if they were buying at discount why would they only pass on the discount if you ordered the 737 and the manual at the same time ..... Move on you say .... No ..... Not until my questions have been answered and I am satisfied .... You don't like my posts .... Then ignore them and don't read them ... And you pooh pooh the NWO stuff ... Don't come crying to me when they come dragging you and your family out to the FEMA camps ... This has everything to do with this site and its members ..... I just want to live a quiet life and fly X plane as much as I can and I don't want to be seeing abrupt adverse changes to all of our lives ... I just want to see fair play and a level playing field which we don't have at the moment ... I also stand corrected .... One percent own more than sixty five percent in of everything !!! 

Look .... It's really simple .... The Chinese are in trouble economically .... So is America and the dollar is probably finished ... So what's the answer ... They all stick together under the umbrella of one centralised bank and one world government and then they must control everyone else and IMHO if we don't come out of Europe we will be under Federal control and much closer to NWO .... And I am sure that like myself you all want to see peace and quiet and be allowed to X plane your nuts off and be able to earn a decent wage away from zero hour contracts and short term contracts because if we are not earning decent wages we can't spend much more on this hobby and there is so much further to go especially I am hoping with scenery Fs X has stunning photo real scenery .... X plane can't be far off matching that now ... And when do we get virtual 3 D air hostesses that we have to keep hidden from our wives !!!!!

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There was another post I just found in X plane forums but couldn't paste - anyway it was the post that I read saying that manual was not specific to this AC -- will copy and post later just for the record .

Why do you need to copy a post "for the record"? Considering that Mike Ray's 737 Classic book has been in print for well over 15 years, (and is available from his own web site, as well as multiple other online vendors), it should be rather obvious that it was not written specifically for the IXEG 737.

There is nothing on the X-Aviation product page that implies it was. You (evidently) made an incorrect assumption, and seem to feel that this is somehow IXEG's fault? Their making a PDF version available at a discount was a nice gesture. They certainly do not need to "defend" having done so.

As for the rest of your rant, you do yourself no favors by posting such opinions, and none of it is applicable to flight simulation.

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