KAPTEJNLN Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 looks grate guys.. im not asking for a releasedate as i know as developer and beta tester it´s never good, but do you think it´s gona be this year or next we gona fly it.. i havent followe that much so sorry if awensered BEST L.N. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XplaneS Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 omg... its looks like neverending story... seriously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 Yeah...and the worst is that the XP-community REALLY is missing a new "heavy" like this, during PMDG releases an excellent 777. Why isn't it possible to just release it and let us participe in some first bugfixes, so that we at least can have some fun now and not just in years :-( Please, please please..... :huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orcair Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) Guys as you should know... Payware aircraft need to be fully bug-free and complete before release or they are given a bad review. Just let them work it needs to be PMDG quality (which I would say it is)to get people to cross over... Edited September 28, 2013 by Orcair 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkyler Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 Why isn't it possible to just release it and let us participe in some first bugfixes, so that we at least can have some fun now and not just in years :-( Because this view is the minority and you can do a lot of damage to your reputation. Most folks, when spending this kind of money expect it all to just work...no surprises, no gotchas....things need to look right, feel right, work right, work as expected, etc etc and that takes quite a while. We're very much in the details stage and for those who know the adage, "The devil (or God) is in the details", then you understand that this phase drags out a while....but is the phase that makes the difference. Its what you don't normally notice that has to be right. You guys will be glad we did! TomK 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) Hi Tom I dont entirely agree. Look at JAR's very good A320. It isn't perfect and is beeing improved with the help of users. Now the latest version is already 1.5 and it becomes better and better. And i really enjoy flying it, even it isn't perfect. Is Jar's reputation really that bad? Thats my opinion but i think it brings more to the XP-community than trying to have the perfection at the first try. Edited September 28, 2013 by frankbyte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameron Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 I don't think it's Tom's job to argue JAR's reputation. Whether you agree or not, Tom gave you an answer, and one I entirely agree with. First impression is everything, and what they are doing appears nothing short of amazing. Hats off to IXEG! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) Cameron, you are talking form the developpper-side. And i was trying to talk from the user-side, since i am very active in a lot of forums. And believe me, people become slowly very annoyed about the situation that nothing happens since months (talking about heavies) and some users would already wanted to switch to FSX if this sim had any future. So i was just sharing this. Edited September 28, 2013 by frankbyte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tkyler Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 I dont entirely agree You certainly have that right and privelege and will judge products from that particular view....though I don't believe a majority share it. The things is....we hear from a lot more users than you do most likely. Sure you get a few in the forums here and there, but we get the emails you don't get and don't see...the private messages, etc and coming up short is just a "no-no" for most users. TomK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameron Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 Cameron, you are talking form the developpper-side. And i was trying to talk from the user-side, since i am very active in a lot of forums. And believe me, people become slowly very annoyed about the situation that nothing happens since months (talking about heavies) and some users would already wanted to switch to FSX if this sim had any future. So i was just sharing this.As someone who deals with more customers and users than most anyone in the market, I know you're wrong.I'll give you my take on JAR: it was a disaster. It's probably the one release I saw consistent user dissatisfaction with. Thankfully the developer has stuck with it and improved.The Saab is a perfect example of doing it right wins. There was lots of praise and appreciation when we announced delays in order to not sell customers short.If people go back to MSFS that's okay. They can always come back, and often times they do! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Russell Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 Don't sink the ship for a penny worth of tar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicola_M Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 And believe me, people become slowly very annoyed about the situation that nothing happens since months (talking about heavies)That's life. People need to understand that making any plane takes months and months, especially heavies. I think both IXEG and LES have done extremely well keeping us updated with progress through all these long months.Have patience. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 Of course. But guys, don't forget that perfection doesn't exist in the sim, even the PMDG 777 isn't perfect. And Cameron, wont like me (once again), but even the Saab isn't perfect. So just relax, don't take this too serious and try to have fun or try to give us some fun ;-) My guess is that people are supporting the "perfect"-strategiy just because they haven't any choice. Let's start a thread asking people if the would like a pre-version, flying it and helping improving it before a new release came out. You will be wondering...but i admit that i can't judge about what this would mean on the technical side. Once again: the example of Jar's A320 shows me and him that this is very appreciated as well ;-) Just my 2 cents.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XplaneS Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 IXEG have no reputation yet, because no beta - no reputation at all.We all ready to by current version "as is", and we are understand completely - it will exist some bugs, however it is our decision and we accept this. In my opinion IXEG never finish this project in simple reason - they working much slower than Laminar Research. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicola_M Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) IXEG have no reputation yet, because no beta - no reputation at all. Individually they do. All of them have put out work in their own right, so there is a reputation to go by. Edited September 28, 2013 by Nicola_M 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 That's true. But on the other side the example of the B777 who has been promised years ago from XP-Jets and never came out has partially ruined their reputation (not here in this forum but i read a lot about it in other forums). So that could be the danger on the other side... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicola_M Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 That's true. But on the other side the example of the B777 who has been promised years ago from XP-Jets and never came out has partially ruined their reputation (not here in this forum but i read a lot about it in other forums). So that could be the danger on the other side...That's not going to happen here. IXEG are on it, and have kept us updated regularly. Not even close to the XPJets scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 That's not going to happen here. IXEG are on it, and have kept us updated regularly. Not even close to the XPJets scenario.Of course, i know ;-) I was just trying to give a counter-example. But releasing (if this is technically possible) a pre-version will be even better imho, since only the mass of users can report about problems with their individual hardware and i guess developers can't find out everything by themselves, even with a lot of tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Russell Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 This isn't minecraft. It doens't work here, trust me. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicola_M Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 You can try all the arguments and reasons in your repertoire, but I'd stake my house on it you're not going to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameron Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 It's not happening, and that's the final answer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orcair Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 Of course, i know ;-) I was just trying to give a counter-example. But releasing (if this is technically possible) a pre-version will be even better imho, since only the mass of users can report about problems with their individual hardware and i guess developers can't find out everything by themselves, even with a lot of tests.A closed-beta test is much safer as it prevents mass-spam of users who are doing something wrong sending bug reports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pryoski Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) but even the Saab isn't perfect. ... you're just plain wrong .. Posted Today, 07:50 AMIXEG have no reputation yet, because no beta - no reputation at all. Now that's just bolshoit ... We all ready to by current version "as is", and we are understand completely - it will exist some bugs, however it is our decision and we accept this.In my opinion IXEG never finish this project in simple reason - they working much slower than Laminar Research. ... that sounds like an *opinion* of someone who sulks when they don't get their way ... Edited September 29, 2013 by Kris Pryo 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 A closed-beta test is much safer as it prevents mass-spam of users who are doing something wrong sending bug reports.I must accept this, since it is the decision of developers the way the wanted it. No discussion about if i am wrong or right. I just hope that the B733 won't have the same huge impact on the HDR-engine as the Saab, since HDR is one of the main reasons to fly XP for me and many others ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankbyte Posted September 28, 2013 Report Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) ... you're just plain wrong ..And you are just a bit naive if you think that a simulation can be perfect ;-) Edited September 28, 2013 by frankbyte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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