Strange Cloud "Bloom" Effect 11.50b6

[FubarHornet]

Hey there,

Recently updated from 11.41 to 11.50b6 - everything seems to be working fine with the sim and all addons / plugins. Only Skymaxx is giving me a hard time atm.
In VC or close to the aircraft i get this strange effect looking at clouds (pic 1). As soon as i move away from the plane the effect is gone. (pic 2)

I have also tried installing skymaxx with a complete new clean install of x11.50b6 to check if any config or other plugin is causing this. Only happens with 4.9.2. regardless of whihc sky or cloud set i select. Also changes in AA dont help. Shadows are set to 4096
Any  suggestions, just recently bought smp / rwc with fsgrw
Thanks

* Edit - did some more trouble shooting, seems it happens also with a clean install of xplane but only with addon aircraft. IXEG, FlightFactor Zibo etc. doesnot happen with default planes

Edited May 5, 2020 by FubarHornet

[Cameron]

I'm guessing this is with Vulkan or Metal? You really should report this to Laminar.

[FubarHornet]

5 minutes ago, Cameron said:

I'm guessing this is with Vulkan or Metal? You really should report this to Laminar.

I ticked the vulkan box in settings thats all, will try opengl now.
i have already posted this in the xplane forum an hour ago but for what ever reason it got deleted.....
will try to repost once i have figured out if its only with vulkan

edit* Just found the setting which is triggering the "bloom effect" its the HDR Visual Effects Settings, as soon as i disable it everything is back to normal, will forward this to laminar !

Edited May 5, 2020 by FubarHornet

[Cameron]

8 minutes ago, FubarHornet said:

i have already posted this in the xplane forum an hour ago but for what ever reason it got deleted.....

Please know that X-Plane.org has NOTHING to do with Laminar.

Bug reports should always be filed here: https://dev.x-plane.com/support/bugreport.html

[FubarHornet]

7 minutes ago, Cameron said:

Please know that X-Plane.org has NOTHING to do with Laminar.

Bug reports should always be filed here: https://dev.x-plane.com/support/bugreport.html

thank you will do so, just to check it only happens with the skymaxx tool installed  - doesnot happen with other third party cloud sets, so the combinations triggering the effect is skymaxx and visual effects set hdr on.

[Cameron]

Just now, FubarHornet said:

thank you will do so, just to check it only happens with the skymaxx tool installed  - doesnot happen with other third party cloud sets, so the combinations triggering the effect is skymaxx and visual effects set hdr on.

I would not expect it to happen with cloud sets. Those are simply default cloud engine texture replacements. SkyMaxx is FAR from a cloud set texture replacement. Comparing them is like apples to peanuts.

[FubarHornet]

1 minute ago, Cameron said:

I would not expect it to happen with cloud sets. Those are simply default cloud engine texture replacements. SkyMaxx is FAR from a cloud set texture replacement. Comparing them is like apples to peanuts.

well following scenario - installing skymaxx and then installing an additional cloud set addon on top/after, eg vividsky or cloudart still has the problem. i uninstall skymaxx and the trouble is gone.
so its either a skymaxx engine / software problem not being compatible to 11.50b6 atm or laminars, meaning hdr setting on is causing it
correct ?

thanks for the quick replies

[Cameron]

For starters, why would you ever do that? It's not like vivid sky or cloud art are compatible with SkyMaxx. Instead, SkyMaxx totally disables the default cloud environment, so I don't understand why you're even trying to do what you are.

The bottom line is SkyMaxx is a plugin. It renders and draws by telling X-Plane what to do. X-Plane obviously has a rendering artifact bug using HDR that SkyMaxx Pro is exploiting on your system. Laminar will want to know about this, and your system.

[FubarHornet]

3 hours ago, Cameron said:

For starters, why would you ever do that? It's not like vivid sky or cloud art are compatible with SkyMaxx. Instead, SkyMaxx totally disables the default cloud environment, so I don't understand why you're even trying to do what you are.

The bottom line is SkyMaxx is a plugin. It renders and draws by telling X-Plane what to do. X-Plane obviously has a rendering artifact bug using HDR that SkyMaxx Pro is exploiting on your system. Laminar will want to know about this, and your system.

Fully understood, was really just to double check for any other errors. I did another complete install X11.50b6 , skymaxx pro latest version and i was able to track down the files which are "responsible" or least need to be active for the effect to occur, see image
its always these four files regardless of the sky preset from skymaxx (of course names will be different then).
As soon as you remove them from the skymaxx shaders installation folder its all fine
maybe its really something within the shader files ?
 

[Cameron]

@sundog will need to chime in on that one.

 

My hunch is that while the shaders may exploit what's happening, this will probably still come down to Laminar. After all, this works as intended in OpenGL.

[sundog]

By removing shader files that SkyMaxx Pro needs, you are rendering it completely inoperable. Don't go deleting its files. It's not telling you that these files are the source of the problem, it's just telling you that you broke SkyMaxx.

That said, I've never seen this happen even though I normally fly with HDR on Vulkan - but I don't use third-party aircraft, either. If it really is *any* third-party aircraft that triggers this, then that does suggest some sort of issue with Laminar's handling of plugins within the Vulkan environment. Filing a bug with Laminar is the right thing to do.

Odd that we haven't heard about this from others though. Anyone else seeing this?

[Cameron]

2 hours ago, sundog said:

Odd that we haven't heard about this from others though. Anyone else seeing this?

Yes, it's previously been reported here: 

 

[seth]

3 hours ago, sundog said:

By removing shader files that SkyMaxx Pro needs, you are rendering it completely inoperable. Don't go deleting its files. It's not telling you that these files are the source of the problem, it's just telling you that you broke SkyMaxx.

That said, I've never seen this happen even though I normally fly with HDR on Vulkan - but I don't use third-party aircraft, either. If it really is *any* third-party aircraft that triggers this, then that does suggest some sort of issue with Laminar's handling of plugins within the Vulkan environment. Filing a bug with Laminar is the right thing to do.

Odd that we haven't heard about this from others though. Anyone else seeing this?

i also have this issue with Zibo + Toliss 321 , X-Plane default aircraft works fine  ( always in 11.50). Will check later FF350 and 767

[sundog]

OK, so I went and downloaded the Zibo 737 to try and see what's going on here.

What I've found is that the issue is specific to:

- Using the Zibo (or other 3rd party aircraft that has the same issue)

- Using Vulkan

- Using HDR graphics mode

- Having clouds near the horizon

Changing any of those things will work around the issue for now. The root of the problem seems to be something drawing in the cockpit of these planes that messes up how the sky is blended in Vulkan mode, but so far I'm having a hard time figuring out exactly what's going on.

Edited May 8, 2020 by sundog

[sundog]

After a quick consultation with Laminar, I think we have a real fix for this issue. It seems these aircraft are changing the blending function, and we need to change it back in a specific way. In my tests here it seems to work.

I'll package up a version 4.9.3 of SMP shortly.

 

[Cameron]

And to follow on what Frank has said, Laminar has now confirmed this as their bug and it will be fixed in the next X-Plane build.

 

In the meantime, we have created a temporary workaround that should be released soon on our end.

[FlyAgi]

On 5/8/2020 at 7:55 PM, sundog said:

It seems these aircraft are changing the blending function

Is there a way to hack this using a dataref?

[JohnMAXX]

1 hour ago, FlyAgi said:

Is there a way to hack this using a dataref?

It’s going to be fixed  

[Cameron]

3 hours ago, FlyAgi said:

Is there a way to hack this using a dataref?

But to answer you directly, no, it has nothing to do with datarefs and is a source code change on our end in the interim until Laminar changes THEIR source code.

[FlyAgi]

Thanks. I thought I could make a work around until it's fixed... :-)

[sundog]

The only work around right now would be to disable Vulkan, or disable HDR.

[xZone]

15 hours ago, JohnMAXX said:

It’s going to be fixed  

some updates, soon? 

[Cameron]

1 hour ago, xZone said:

some updates, soon? 

http://forums.x-pilot.com/forums/topic/17733-strange-cloud-bloom-effect-1150b6/?do=findComment&comment=149247

Evidently you already read that and "liked" it. Did you already forget?

[FubarHornet]

appreciate you guys took a look into this - great support !