BaBene Posted November 24, 2015 Report Posted November 24, 2015 Hey BaBene, Thanks for all your coherent commentary in this, and best wishes going into the holidays! Hey Cameron, thanks for giving me the opportunity to express and to react to my thoughts and opinions on this topic. Best wishes from me to you and your team as well. You might want to sweeten my holidays with the release of your great product? Never mind, just kidding. Take your time to amaze us all Best regards and wishes, BaBene 1
tkyler Posted November 24, 2015 Report Posted November 24, 2015 Hi BaBene....I read over my post and noticed I left out a few adjectives...which I normally don't do, but certainly can see how you've taken offense. What I should have clarified was when I said, "linux users that we have communicated with regarding x-plane products......blah blah...demanded". So I would absolutely agree with your statements about the majority of linux users not being so; however, we are not fortunate enough to deal with the non-complaining majority as much as the complaining minority (relative to linux user base) so we only see the complainers. Thanks for the encouraging words, and again, me and my linux box here next to me apologize for sweeping us all up into our prejudices! -tkyler
BaBene Posted November 24, 2015 Report Posted November 24, 2015 Hey tkyler, no worries. As already mentioned I do accept your apologies Give your linux box a hug from me Thanks for replying! Best regards, BaBene
Rodeo Posted December 8, 2015 Report Posted December 8, 2015 Out of curiosity, which navdata format will your plane be using? IIRC someone mentioned it's a mix of two existing formats, but which ones would that be?
Cameron Posted December 8, 2015 Report Posted December 8, 2015 Out of curiosity, which navdata format will your plane be using? IIRC someone mentioned it's a mix of two existing formats, but which ones would that be? We'll discuss that at a later date if need be. The ultimate goal is to contact the usual sources of data and have them create a dataset based on the IXEG choices so you don't have to even think about it.
Rodeo Posted December 8, 2015 Report Posted December 8, 2015 We'll discuss that at a later date if need be. The ultimate goal is to contact the usual sources of data and have them create a dataset based on the IXEG choices so you don't have to even think about it. Yes but I do want to think about it, hence the "out of curiosity". But I guess my real question is, which of Navigraph's packages started to have weird mid-file syntax changes not too long ago? Don't really care about the other, presumably trouble-free format
Cameron Posted December 8, 2015 Report Posted December 8, 2015 But I guess my real question is, which of Navigraph's packages started to have weird mid-file syntax changes not too long ago? Don't really care about the other, presumably trouble-free format I don't remember which of the two it was, but pretty sure it was LVL D. Out of curiosity, why do you want to think about it?
Rodeo Posted December 8, 2015 Report Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) Oh dear, AFAIK LVL D is what the GNS430/B757/B777 databases are based on, and thus also what my tool attempts to use, so now I'm triply curious, you wouldn't have an example of the issue I could look at please? Edited December 8, 2015 by Rodeo
Cameron Posted December 8, 2015 Report Posted December 8, 2015 Oh **** AFAIK LVL D is what the GNS430/B757/B777 databases are based on, and thus also what my tool attempts to use, so now I'm triply curious, you wouldn't have an example of the issue I could look at please? I don't honestly have much time to start giving breakdowns of Navigraph files, nor does the team for the time being. The 737 has been 5 years in development. At some point in that process some stuff changed, and we've still got to go over the data to figure out if it's an accident on their part or not. If you are not having issues with your tool currently then I suppose you have nothing to worry about. This really isn't a thread for debugging other products!
sparkie66 Posted December 19, 2015 Report Posted December 19, 2015 1 year of datasets from aerosoft 30 euro..... Wtf are we even talking about.
Chimo Posted December 19, 2015 Report Posted December 19, 2015 Folks, as stated, Aerosoft supports essentially all formats as far as I can tell. This may ultimately mean you stop subscribing to one and move to the other. Their supported list includes: Aerosoft Airbus A318 / A319 Aerosoft AirbusX Extended/Standard (FSX; Prepar3D) FlightSim Commander (FSX; Prepar3D) FS Navigator (FS2004) aeroSystem 737 Avionics AivlaSoft Electronic Flight Bag (FSX/Prepa3d v2) CaptainSim 757/767 (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Digital Aviation Piper Cheyenne (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Eurowings Professional (FS2004) EADT KLN 90B (X-Plane) Eaglesoft Cessna Citation (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Flight1 ATR 72, BN2-Islander, C182T, Fokker, Mustang, Super 80 Professional (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) FSBuild 2.4 FsXPand - Flyware (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) iFly Boeing 737 (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Integrated Simavionics (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) JRollon Planes CRJ200 (X-Plane) Level-D 767 (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Majestic Dash 8 Q400 (FSX/Prepa3d/Prepa3d v2) PMDG alle Produkte (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Pointsoft PRO-ATC/X Prosim 737 PSS Boeing 777; A330; A340 (FS2004) QualityWings 757 (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) QualityWings Jumbolino (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Sim-Avionics Flightdeck Avionics TuneVNAV Descent Pro3 vasFMC X-FMC (X-Plane) Wilco/Feelthere 737/777 Airbus, Citation X, Embraer E-Jets v.2, Legacy (FSX; Prepar3D; FS2004) Ideal Flight 10 777 Worldliner Professional/Extended (X-Plane) Boeing 757 Professional (X-Plane) JARDesign A320neo (X-Plane) JeeHellWare FJCC Universal FMC (X-Plane) SSG B748-i Global ATC Simcheck A300 FMC (FSX) EFASS - Electronic Flight Assistant Professional Flight Planner X X-Plane 10 (V 10.00 - 10.xx) GNS430 (X-Plane 10.30) SimLauncherX @mgeiss the format is already a mix of two existing formats. Navigraph still does not work at this time.AirTrack for Ipad is not supportet , one of my reasons to use NavigraphChimo
deetee Posted December 20, 2015 Report Posted December 20, 2015 Simbrief is also not supported. This is the only reason why I use Navigraph Airac data. Their charts cloud is actually very good but uses a separate subscription.As I mentioned elsewhere, the logical path further down the line will be for IXEG to use to the X-Plane GNS430 Airac data, which is available since v10.3x and updatable by both Aerosoft and Navigraph datasets. FlightFactor aircraft use this now on all their Boeings, with Jardesign starting to move over with their latest A320 beta.
KAPTEJNLN Posted December 20, 2015 Report Posted December 20, 2015 well to understand the logic behind the problem is it´s not that much about where the data is stored and such.. As in fact all developers could agree on creating a given folder anywhere for all add-ons you pay for. That would be smart and easy as you then would only need 1 spot to update all add-ons.. The reason why you would do that rather then selecting the GNS430 is that X-plane is in constant development, it can be good and bad.. The good thing is that improvements can be done, the bad is from a developers perspective as things may brake along the road, and have already caused developers headache, as they have to constant work on it when things are edited. That is the same for P3D at the moment... Where good old FSX is solid no new updates for the boxed version and developers found ways around the problems by the simulator but don´t need to fear a update in the future, so time is better invested that way.. So in fact no one know if Laminar would move in another direction at some point and skip GNS430 again and create other stuff, then all developers that may have used this style could be forced to reconsider what to to next. Another thing I learned about the data for X-Plane is that now some of you might know I am testing stuff for different company´s mostly FSX and a few X-Plane projects. What I found lately was the limitation of X-Plane own handling of flight plan´s.. As you would know even X-plane uses GNS430, it only use in case of the FMS the procedures from there GNS430 but all other data is given from another location by 2 files to keep it short I don´t mention where they are and all that stuff. So in fact it uses 2 reference points and no one knows if they start edit that at a point and why I stated as above it´s mostly safe to pick your own location to prevent that to become a problem over time.. And that it uses those 2 reference points you will see lots of problems if you run whit out updating data in fact X-plane right out of the box uses 2 different AIRAC that is over 1 year between them. I cant mention any info about project and such ofcause as tester but there was coded a lot to make the plane select the best point but it was not good, ofcause you would notice it that much, but again why I also say keep things seperately. And yes the data is all in the GNS430 but right out of the box not used directly by the FMS not sure for the GPS.. it is not the same as in this case you walk away from the default FMS system but I think gives a good explanation why things are not that logical as it might seems to the end user as there are many aspects. Then we come to the main point that is more relevant for this project is how data is given if you study the many add-ons out there and the data provided from Lufthansa Lido and Navigraph there are much difference in how the data is given some add-ons have more data it can use for procedures other it is not there but that´s a bit to technical to talk about even I learned from the different codes and such. That´s why not all uses the same data as it depends on there need for there given product. It is correct that for X-plane it seems more add-on developers use the same data then in the past of FSX.. but I would stop now as else it would be to long
Rodeo Posted December 23, 2015 Report Posted December 23, 2015 The problem we've seen with Navigraph is that their format for procedures is inconsistent. We obviously have to write code to parse the file and interpret the procedures and Navigraph will have, in the same file, two separate syntax for the same type of procedure...and while we read one of them fine, there is a new one in there also that would take a bit of effort to parse. What this means is that if you use the navigraph dataset, then some procedure will be missing from the FMS. Ultimately, we can add code to parse this "strange syntax", but its not our first choice. The fact that there is two 'competing' syntax in the file for the same procedure type doesn't make any sense and we'd rather navigraph correct the issue. If they do that, then there is absolutely no problem with using the navigraph format. We will look into the issue post release. -tkyler Just a quick reminder after reading the last few posts; i.e. it's not about pricing or whether one supports more addons than the other, but a technical difficulty for which the fix/workaround has been postponed until more important issues are addressed.
tkyler Posted December 23, 2015 Report Posted December 23, 2015 (edited) well worded Rodeo...however, some potentially good news.....I've encountered the same XML anomaly in the Aerosoft dataset...but not in the same files as the Navigraph dataset. Seems we can't avoid having to handle this syntax. it'll throw us back a very tiny bit, but what it means is that it should not matter whom your vendor is. fingers crossed this all works -tkyler Edited December 23, 2015 by tkyler 2
Fabio Pittol Posted December 23, 2015 Report Posted December 23, 2015 1 year of datasets from aerosoft 30 euro..... Wtf are we even talking about. The same period of time, from Navigraph is 27.48 euros, so, nowhere to run, really. Anyway, as others have already said, the problem is that Navigraph just doesn't answer developer "calls". It tried to contact them myself, a few times. Ignored. Contacted Aerosoft, and got an answer days latter. That's unfortunate, for Navigraph, cause they have a heck of a product.
Eddie Posted December 23, 2015 Report Posted December 23, 2015 The same period of time, from Navigraph is 27.48 euros, so, nowhere to run, really.Navigraph also offers the chart bundle, though.
yukonpete Posted January 1, 2016 Report Posted January 1, 2016 I pay for my Navigraph navdata and charts subscription per year and just renewed it. Would be a disappointment to only provide the aerosoft navdata support as many like myself use Navigraph.
kpregira Posted January 1, 2016 Report Posted January 1, 2016 I just purchased Aerosoft Navdata Pro for $19.95 US. I'm ready to roll when you are IXEG 737 Classic. By the way, I also just renewed my subscription to Navigraph about a month ago..... So what no big deal, we're not talking about THAT much money.
yukonpete Posted January 4, 2016 Report Posted January 4, 2016 I just purchased Aerosoft Navdata Pro for $19.95 US. I'm ready to roll when you are IXEG 737 Classic. By the way, I also just renewed my subscription to Navigraph about a month ago..... So what no big deal, we're not talking about THAT much money.You only got 4 updates! A full year is US$28. For me that is $40 in my currency! not cheap. I already have a full subscription service with Navigraph.
Cameron Posted January 4, 2016 Report Posted January 4, 2016 You only got 4 updates! A full year is US$28. For me that is $40 in my currency! not cheap. I already have a full subscription service with Navigraph. Hey Pete!, Just curious...where do you live?Also, how much is a tank of gas where you live? Not entirely relevant, just trying to understand your perspective.
kpregira Posted January 4, 2016 Report Posted January 4, 2016 Why do you subscribe to the charts when you can do Skyvector.com for free Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
kpregira Posted January 4, 2016 Report Posted January 4, 2016 I myself use Foreflight on my iPad Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Recommended Posts