[SOLVED] Condition lever + CH throttle quadrant

[ss8913]

OK, I've looked over the documentation on this and followed it exactly, and it acts like it's going to work, up until the point that it does not.

 

I've got a CH Throttle Quadrant with 6 levers.  Generally I use the prop levers for condition levers, in turboprops.  So, following the instructions, I:

 

1. went into settings -> joystick axes, unassigned the two prop levers (set them to 'None')

2. Opened up the gizmo64 "Assign Saab CL" window

3.  Checked the checkbox on left CL

4. pushed 'start' on step 1

5.  pushed 'start' on step 2

6.  it says 'SEARCHING'

7.  move the left condition lever on the throttle quadrant

8.  it says 'ASSIGNED ID: 34'

 

ok, great.  But moving the physical lever does not move the condition lever in the sim.  I have several other peripherals connected, (and it sometimes picks up ID 21 by mistake, if I'm not moving anything, not sure what that is), but none of the other levers/etc on any other device, do anything in the sim. 

 

What should I try next?

[JGregory]

This should work fine... although the steps you listed are a little out of  order.  After your step 4, you should proceed to assign the left condition lever and then do the right.  One at a time as follows ...

 

Assign the left Condition Lever first, and then the right Condition Lever.  You should get an Assignment ID of the left Condition Lever BEFORE you go on to assigning the right Condition Lever.

 

Be VERY CAREFUL not to move any other axes while doing the assignment... they are very sensitive.

 

Let us know how you make out.

[ss8913]

yeah, sorry I did actually do what you describe, in that order (left then right).  Doesn't matter, though, neither axis does anything.  Where is the config file that is getting written by this?  I could go in there and verify that the right axis is being written, and compare to the x-plane default config file and make sure the numbers match...?

[JGregory]

yeah, sorry I did actually do what you describe, in that order (left then right).  Doesn't matter, though, neither axis does anything.  Where is the config file that is getting written by this?  I could go in there and verify that the right axis is being written, and compare to the x-plane default config file and make sure the numbers match...?

There is no config file.  If you get the "ASSIGNED ID : XX" then the process should have worked fine.  You can verify this by going to the axis window and when you move your joystick you can visualize it.  Also, make sure that it is assigned to "NONE".

[Cameron]

Also, make sure that it is assigned to "NONE".

Even this one has got me before!

Let us know how you do!

[iandiss]

Having exactly the same problem with my saitek throttle quadrants.

[torfih]

Having problems with my Saitek quadrants, I have managed to assign the Contidition Levers but after a short while I loose them again and have to start all over again.

 

So it goes:

I assign the C/L, do an Autostart, assignment lost, try to reassign the C/L the respective engine shuts down ....

Edited September 22, 2013 by torfih

[Goran_M]

For now, if you are having issues with the Condition Levers, instead of using the calibration screen, use the built in manipulators.  Center manipulator (indicated by a double arrow) controls both Condition Levers.  Moving the mouse over each individual manipulator will display a "hand" cursor which is used for THAT particular manipulator.

Apologies for this inconvenience.  Jim and/or Cameron will reply soon.

[tomcat357]

My condition levers work fine 

 

 

[saab Condition Levers]

axis=12

dataref=LES/saab/CL/manip_common(float)

drh=1

drl=0

[JGregory]

Hi Guys,

 

I have looked into this.  We have found an issue where the index assignments were being lost during autostart.  In addition, I have revised the code to desensitize the assignment process.  We will be getting an update out with these changes... not exactly sure when that will be just yet, stay tuned!

 

If you are using Auto-Start, it is important to set your condition levers (joystick) at the "start" position prior to initiating the Auto-Start.  This ensures that your joystick axis values match what the code is doing during Auto-Start.  This will be critical once we get the update out.

 

Thanks for the feedback.

 

Jim

Lead Programmer

LES Saab 340A

Edited September 22, 2013 by JGregory

[lonewulf47]

So far I haven't had too many problems in assigning the CL's to my two Saitek-Axes despinte the fact that sometimes I need to repeat the assignment more than once as the detection routine is definitley a bit too sensitive  . However I noticed that I need to reassign them after each loading of the A/C...?!?!? Is there no possibility to keep those assignments stored?

[Mario Donick]

So far I haven't had too many problems in assigning the CL's to my two Saitek-Axes despinte the fact that sometimes I need to repeat the assignment more than once as the detection routine is definitley a bit too sensitive  . However I noticed that I need to reassign them after each loading of the A/C...?!?!? Is there no possibility to keep those assignments stored?

 

Did you do what Jim suggested in the post above yours?

[JGregory]

So far I haven't had too many problems in assigning the CL's to my two Saitek-Axes despinte the fact that sometimes I need to repeat the assignment more than once as the detection routine is definitley a bit too sensitive  . However I noticed that I need to reassign them after each loading of the A/C...?!?!? Is there no possibility to keep those assignments stored?

Unfortunately, there is no guarantee that the axes will be the same across every sim session or aircraft load. Therefore, we cannot save these and re-assign when you start the sim.

 

Jim

Lead Programmer

LES Saab 340A

[lonewulf47]

Unfortunately, there is no guarantee that the axes will be the same across every sim session or aircraft load. Therefore, we cannot save these and re-assign when you start the sim.

 

Jim

Lead Programmer

LES Saab 340A

Ok, that answers my question  . Nevertheless I must declare this as a negaitve point. Configurations that do not save with the A/C are not really welcome. I know that we have to live with that but maybe once in a while you might come up with a better solution

 

Oskar

[JGregory]

Ok, that answers my question  . Nevertheless I must declare this as a negaitve point. Configurations that do not save with the A/C are not really welcome. I know that we have to live with that but maybe once in a while you might come up with a better solution

 

Oskar

Oskar, 

 

Maybe you misunderstood what I was saying. There is no way that we could provide a better solution. It is impossible to guarantee that the index will be the same when you reload the aircraft or restart the sim.  Even if we saved the index it may not be the same the next time around and therefore would not work.  This is not something we have any control over.

 

Jim

Lead Programmer

LES Saab 340A

[Mario Donick]

How does X-Plane itself remember its settings?

[BWolf7]

deleted

Edited July 16, 2016 by BWolf7

[JGregory]

How does X-Plane itself remember its settings?

Standard X-Plane axes assignments are much different than what is happening in the Saab.  X-Plane assigns functionality to an axis, ie. throttle.  In the Saab we need to know which axis your joystick is using (assigned as none) in order to make the condition levers work properly.  That index can change between sim sessions, loading aircraft, etc. I'm not saying that it is guaranteed to change, but it's also not guaranteed to be the same.  Some people may change hardware between sessions.  There are just too many variables to be able to save the index and guarantee that it will be correct the next time around.

[Mario Donick]

I believe the preference files.

 

Hehe, yeah. What I meant was: Technically.

 

If I understood Jim correctly, the problem is that between sessions the internal IDs of the connected peripherals might change, so for example on one day your joystick has ID 2, on the next day it has ID 5. Probably this happens esp. if you plug off the peripherals inbetween.

[BWolf7]

deleted

Edited July 16, 2016 by BWolf7

[ss8913]

The Jetstream32 has this same problem with the condition levers.  The Saab folks have attempted to at least solve the problem, however - on the JS32 you can't assign the condition levers to an axis, period, and you have to use the mouse manipulators... I'm hoping that this can get resolved soon.  BTW I am not using autostart, I'm doing everything manually which is why I'd really like this to work.  It's not that I"m losing the assignments - the assignments say "OK assigned" but *nothing happens*.. i move the lever, nothing happens on the screen.

 

Going to go try it again. When you say "verify in the axis screen for settings" - what am I looking for there?  I've used these levers for prop control for a long time, but I have made sure they're set to None before starting the process... am I looking for something in this screen that says "Saab CL" or...? I'm not sure what I'm supposedly able to verify in the axis settings screen within X-Plane?

[JGregory]

The Jetstream32 has this same problem with the condition levers.  The Saab folks have attempted to at least solve the problem, however - on the JS32 you can't assign the condition levers to an axis, period, and you have to use the mouse manipulators... I'm hoping that this can get resolved soon.  BTW I am not using autostart, I'm doing everything manually which is why I'd really like this to work.  It's not that I"m losing the assignments - the assignments say "OK assigned" but *nothing happens*.. i move the lever, nothing happens on the screen.

NOt sure why your levers would not be moving.  No one reported such a problem during beta testing.  My point regarding Auto-Start was that IF you were using it then your assignements might get lost. It would probably be best that you wait for the update and see if that solves your issues.

 

oing to go try it again. When you say "verify in the axis screen for settings" - what am I looking for there?  I've used these levers for prop control for a long time, but I have made sure they're set to None before starting the process... am I looking for something in this screen that says "Saab CL" or...? I'm not sure what I'm supposedly able to verify in the axis settings screen within X-Plane?

When viewing the axes, we want you to verify that when you move your levers you can see the movement on that screen and that the assignment selected is "NONE".

 

Jim

Lead Programmer

LES Saab 340A

[ss8913]

ok more info on this:

 

1.  I got it to work (but:)

2.  Please make a way to manually type in the axis ID - that would simplify my life quite a bit since I know which axis # I want here.  I have a faulty potentiometer, it seems, in one of my toe brake axes which is causing ID 21 to pop up a lot instead of 32 & 33 which I need.

3.  I got the left one assigned properly, then went to do the right one.  After fighting with it for 10 minutes I got it to pick up axis 33 instead of 21.  Great.  but it still didn't work - the left one did, the right one didn't.  So I took a wild guess and *unchecked* the "right CL uses joystick" box - which shouldn't work, but *that fixed it*.  That might be something you want to look into as that's not how it's supposed to work ... but it does, so I'm going to go fly it.

Please let me know if there's anything else you want me to check/help test/etc, I'd be happy to follow a test plan and post a full report for you to look at.  Also, letting me manually key in the axis ID would be super helpful - although if you're lowering the detection sensitivity, that might also solve the problem in the next patch.

[JGregory]

ok more info on this:

 

1.  I got it to work (but:)

2.  Please make a way to manually type in the axis ID - that would simplify my life quite a bit since I know which axis # I want here.  I have a faulty potentiometer, it seems, in one of my toe brake axes which is causing ID 21 to pop up a lot instead of 32 & 33 which I need.

3.  I got the left one assigned properly, then went to do the right one.  After fighting with it for 10 minutes I got it to pick up axis 33 instead of 21.  Great.  but it still didn't work - the left one did, the right one didn't.  So I took a wild guess and *unchecked* the "right CL uses joystick" box - which shouldn't work, but *that fixed it*.  That might be something you want to look into as that's not how it's supposed to work ... but it does, so I'm going to go fly it.

Please let me know if there's anything else you want me to check/help test/etc, I'd be happy to follow a test plan and post a full report for you to look at.  Also, letting me manually key in the axis ID would be super helpful - although if you're lowering the detection sensitivity, that might also solve the problem in the next patch.

A couple things...

 

1.) Typing in the ID manually will not work, so , that is not an option we will be pursuing. 

2.) While you may think that unchecking the "RIght CL Uses Joystick" has solved your problem, I can guarantee it will cause other problems. 

 

We should wait for the update and see what happens.  I don't want to diagnose problems that may already be fixed.

 

Jim

Lead Programmer

LES Saab 340A

[ss8913]

it's not just the 'right' one, it seems that if it picks up the wrong ID and you restart the process, and then it gets the correct ID, you have to uncheck the box to make the lever move.  I've tested this a few ways and that behavior is consistent. Regardless of the position of the checkbox, when the lever moves correctly, it's "working" - I've done a few flights with it now, regardless of the checkbox indicator, if you can get the lever on screen to move with the physical lever, that is the success condition, and once I get it to that point, it works flawlessly.

 

All of that said, once I get to the point where it works and once I figured out that the prop RPM gauges seem to be driven by the AC inverters, the plane flies really well, and I like it a lot.  Although if you advance the condition levers too fast, you'll get to a point where the turbine is spinning but the generator won't engage and the prop RPM shows 0... have to reset the plane to fix that - but that belongs in a different thread, and I'm not 100% sure if it's "supposed to" work like that or not.. as I've never flown a real one.