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FlightSim Expo 2023


Rick310
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From what I see on FSElite.net. MSFS2024 has taken center stage at the FlightSim Expo 2023. And most of the Developers are focused on MSFS2020 and MSFS2024. Except for the developers here at x-pilot.com.  Sorry x-plane fans, No question in my mind, X-plane 12 has taken a back seat at the FlightSim Expo 2023.

Austin and LR better pick up their game if they want to keep up with Mircrosoft. Now would be the time for Austin to STEP IT UP! Or X-plane 12 will crash and burn. And Microsoft will be in full control of the flight sim world again. If they are not already???

NOT me, X-plane forever. Mircrosoft can kiss my a@#.

Just calling it like I see it.

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It is pretty clear Austin has been perfectly happy operating in the background of MSFS since inception, and has no illusions of keeping up with the MS juggernaut in whatever direction they are heading.  The only difference, as mentioned in his latest interview, is that it now takes a team of 25 instead of 3 to achieve his next goals for the sim.  I do wonder if revenues can support this large a team with new versions coming out every 4-5 years.

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7 hours ago, Rick310 said:

From what I see on FSElite.net. MSFS2024 has taken center stage at the FlightSim Expo 2023. And most of the Developers are focused on MSFS2020 and MSFS2024. Except for the developers here at x-pilot.com.  Sorry x-plane fans, No question in my mind, X-plane 12 has taken a back seat at the FlightSim Expo 2023.

Austin and LR better pick up their game if they want to keep up with Mircrosoft. Now would be the time for Austin to STEP IT UP! Or X-plane 12 will crash and burn. And Microsoft will be in full control of the flight sim world again. If they are not already???

NOT me, X-plane forever. Mircrosoft can kiss my a@#.

Just calling it like I see it.

I have lost count of the number of 3rd party developers who are deeply unhappy with the way LR has mismanaged XP12.  Absolutely appalling. These devs are not going to sit and wait for LR to sort themselves out. Many see good opportunities in the MSFS world & they are entitled to take advantage of them to earn some money.

 

 

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2 hours ago, scooke7 said:

Absolutely appalling

All the developers have input and in site into what Laminar is doing, there is no easy way to change the guts of a flight sim without problems, and since the only way forward is to get rid of legacy stuff that is holding the sim back, it was bound to cause pain, but for all the pain, we get a far superior sim. "Appalling", really?. We still have our biggest developers with us.

Xplane isnt about pretty graphics, its teh underlying engime simulation and flight model tha tchanges as new things are discovered to make it more real, like N1 and N2 being separated in XP12 to make engine start ups more real, like aircon and gen now adding load to engine which causes it to run hotter etc, this is what makes this sim different from the rest. I doubt the complaints will ever end.

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3 hours ago, StuSpeed said:

It is pretty clear Austin has been perfectly happy operating in the background of MSFS since inception, and has no illusions of keeping up with the MS juggernaut in whatever direction they are heading.  The only difference, as mentioned in his latest interview, is that it now takes a team of 25 instead of 3 to achieve his next goals for the sim.  I do wonder if revenues can support this large a team with new versions coming out every 4-5 years.

Thanks for your opinion Stu.

It seems obvious to me that a million users of X-Plane 12 at $60 can easily support 25 motivated core programmers at Laminar. They don't have Microsoft overhead nor have they given the reigns to a third party. They will also commit to XP12 for as long as it takes, not promise 10 years and rescind after 3, with a sloppy and buggy product which will cost another $120 bucks... Modus Operandi comes to mind!

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8 hours ago, mjrhealth said:

All the developers have input and in site into what Laminar is doing, there is no easy way to change the guts of a flight sim without problems, and since the only way forward is to get rid of legacy stuff that is holding the sim back, it was bound to cause pain, but for all the pain, we get a far superior sim. "Appalling", really?. We still have our biggest developers with us.

Xplane isnt about pretty graphics, its teh underlying engime simulation and flight model tha tchanges as new things are discovered to make it more real, like N1 and N2 being separated in XP12 to make engine start ups more real, like aircon and gen now adding load to engine which causes it to run hotter etc, this is what makes this sim different from the rest. I doubt the complaints will ever end.

Xlua was not developed by a 3rd party. It is a LR implementation. Yet it is, as of 12.05, sucking fps out of XP12 like no other component. That LR haven't fixed it or made sure it was not in the release from the get-go is "absolutely appalling". And if this is the situation with their own module, it doesn't take Einstein to figure out how badly 3rd party devs have been treated. If devs really had input into what LR is doing (I doubt this), then it just shows that LR hasn't planned XP12 well. Zink is another example.

LR has demonstrated with XP12 that they lack proper release management skills.

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2 hours ago, scooke7 said:

LR has demonstrated with XP12 that they lack proper release management skills.

Yes every one bags XP, as i have said before, we have so many experts out there, im surprised we dont have a dozen other perfect sims. when xplane goes through these cycle, all developers can chat with Laminar as to whats going on, thats why they sometimes hold back, which i think is the case with the .06 update, Id be surprised if developers dont make up part of the testing team, they would be silly not to.  Like any updates, one fixes the worst things first than get to the less important things later, thats what Laminar is doing. I be surprised that they are not aware of the XLUA and SSL issues. but some things arent as easy to fix as some would think. Im a patient person, I was born at a time where parents had nothing and we where given out of there poverty, so we appreciate everything we get. How things have changed.

Back on topic. Lets wait see what Laminar brings up.

Edited by mjrhealth
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5 hours ago, scooke7 said:

Xlua was not developed by a 3rd party. It is a LR implementation. Yet it is, as of 12.05, sucking fps out of XP12 like no other component. That LR haven't fixed it or made sure it was not in the release from the get-go is "absolutely appalling". And if this is the situation with their own module, it doesn't take Einstein to figure out how badly 3rd party devs have been treated. If devs really had input into what LR is doing (I doubt this), then it just shows that LR hasn't planned XP12 well. Zink is another example.

LR has demonstrated with XP12 that they lack proper release management skills.

As a member of the Laminar team, and the team member who uses XLua the most, I can tell you your assumptions are all wrong.

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2 minutes ago, JGregory said:

As a member of the Laminar team, and the team member who uses XLua the most, I can tell you your assumptions are all wrong.

As a member of the Laminar team, Please give me a little insight about what is going on with X-plane 12. Maybe a short little roadmap?

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4 hours ago, Rick310 said:

As a member of the Laminar team, Please give me a little insight about what is going on with X-plane 12. Maybe a short little roadmap?

That is far too broad a question to provide an answer to.  And, it's not my department! :). Suffice it to say there is a LOT going on.

 

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2 hours ago, JGregory said:

That is far too broad a question to provide an answer to.  And, it's not my department! :). Suffice it to say there is a LOT going on.

 

Not the answer I was looking for, but I get it. Not your department. I have not bought x-plane 12 for reasons I have already shared on x-pilot.com.

Thank-you for your time, Sir.

I have yet to see a brand new flight simulator just released that ain't a piece of garbage. I bought x-plane 11 in 2019, two years after it was released and I have had 5 CTD's since I bought the simulator. And x-plane 12 after two years of being released will be stable and have plenty of 3rd party stuff available.

Edited by Rick310
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Here is just 1 example of my "assumptions"

But remember, as I never had to go through poverty and never had things given to me, I will never know how GREAT XP12 is. I only paid for it!

But paying for it means I can never say true things about it!

XP12 is finished....long before it even started. And remember DON'T start with just any aircraft, start with the Cessna 172 & then switch to your aircraft of choice especially that shiny new E175 that you bought for $74.

XP12 screen 1.png

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1 hour ago, scooke7 said:

Here is just 1 example of my "assumptions"

But remember, as I never had to go through poverty and never had things given to me, I will never know how GREAT XP12 is. I only paid for it!

But paying for it means I can never say true things about it!

XP12 is finished....long before it even started. And remember DON'T start with just any aircraft, start with the Cessna 172 & then switch to your aircraft of choice especially that shiny new E175 that you bought for $74.

 

May I ask what that post was all about?? Made no sense.

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4 hours ago, scooke7 said:

Here is just 1 example of my "assumptions"

But remember, as I never had to go through poverty and never had things given to me, I will never know how GREAT XP12 is. I only paid for it!

But paying for it means I can never say true things about it!

XP12 is finished....long before it even started. And remember DON'T start with just any aircraft, start with the Cessna 172 & then switch to your aircraft of choice especially that shiny new E175 that you bought for $74.

XP12 screen 1.png

Proves absolutely nothing!  Post the entire Log.txt.

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7 hours ago, scooke7 said:

XP12 is finished....long before it even started

we've been listening to these type of claims for 20+ years.   Granted that differing folks use different words to describe how they feel about things.....to each their own.....but this is simply bombastic IMO.

Have you ever thought about writing for CNN or Fox News?   Your commentary would be absolutely SHOCKING, the likes of which have never been heard in the history of the world.

-tkyler

Edited by tkyler
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I am an ignorant guy who has been on xp since version 9. I've been hearing that xp is dying since I started in this of the simulation, I suppose that years will pass and we will continue with the same song while I will continue to enjoy the little that leaves me the life of this magnificent software product that is XP.

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7 hours ago, Rick310 said:

Please lock this tread. It is getting ugly.

Not going to do that, but suffice to say this is all just conjecture and speculation by all of us. ...its just 'conversation', not much more that that.   None of us know what will happen, but we all have our thoughts.    I myself think XPlane is not in any danger of dying any time soon...just my opinion

-tkyler

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4 minutes ago, tkyler said:

Not going to do that, but suffice to say this is all just conjecture and speculation by all of us. ...its just 'conversation', not much more that that.   None of us know what will happen, but we all have our thoughts.    I myself think XPlane is not in any danger of dying any time soon...just my opinion

-tkyler

Ok, I think Laminar will fix X-plane 12 in time. I said it once and I will say it again. Every flight simulator just released is garbage. Look at FSX when it first was released. That was a real piece of work. I remember hearing about x-plane 11 when it first came out, same stuff.

X-plane is not going away, Austin has too much invested and he likes the money also.

I will wait two years and look at X-plane 12 again. For now I will keep enjoying X-plane 11. And x-plane 11 will look really good with my new top end computer coming in mid July. 

Thank-you for your comments. This forum will let the sh#$ fly. Cool.

 

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On 6/25/2023 at 10:12 AM, JGregory said:

That is far too broad a question to provide an answer to.  And, it's not my department! :). Suffice it to say there is a LOT going on.

 

So Austin pays you money sit in this forum and tell paying customers that their wrong? Your co worker Ben will answer any and all questions to the best of his knowledge. And you answer no questions? Why? How much do you really know about x-plane period? If anything at all.

I wonder what Austin would say if he heard what you were saying to paying customers? Customers all ways right when you are in business.

Not your department. Kiss my A#$.

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2 hours ago, mjrhealth said:

Wont change anything just be another xp12 topic shut down.

Any ways, we wait for the interview, Why it needed to be delayed when he released all the others I dont know, unless he had some visuals to add.

What are you talking about? What interview? No one is going to interview you. You don't know nothing. You are full of BS. Do  you even know how fly an airplane in any simulator? I don't think so. Every question I have ask you about flying, you can not answer. Because you know nothing about flying that's why.

Edited by Rick310
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47 minutes ago, Rick310 said:

What are you talking about? What interview? No one is going to interview you. You don't know nothing. You are full of BS. Do  you even know how fly an airplane in any simulator? I don't think so. Every question I have ask you about flying, you can not answer. Because you know nothing about flying that's why.

You really are an angry man. Where did i say "me ". Besides everyone knows how you feel. Laminar where interviewed at expo. Said will be released in few days. Thats where thise cloud pics came from. It mentioned on there twitter page.

As for the flying part, i have no need to respond to you.  It wont be nice, very plain to see.

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