FSX AND PMDG versus the best of Xplane

[MatthewS]

The problem with this statement is that it's speculation on your part. You assume the return would be small for the investment. I can tell you without hesitation that the money is there, and some products have in very obvious ways shown so to those that need to know.

It's a question of how much investment we are talking about...  I think X-Plane devs grossly underestimate the amount of investment required by PMDG to produce the NGX.  Would such investment be recouped in the X-Plane market?  How many CRJ-200 units have been sold?  1,000? 10,000? more?

[Goran_M]

How many CRJ-200 units have been sold?  1,000? 10,000? more?

Wow.  Now that's overstepping the line.

I will say, in the nicest and sincerest way possible, none of your business.

It's not my product, but it's a very bad question to ask.

[MatthewS]

How many CRJ-200 units have been sold?  1,000? 10,000? more?

Wow.  Now that's overstepping the line.

I will say, in the nicest and sincerest way possible, none of your business.

It's not my product, but it's a very bad question to ask.

Why?  Would'nt release of this information be a good thing for XP?

I'm sure many FSX devs would be very interested to know the size of the XP market.  This might encourage more FSX devs to take XP more seriously.

Magazines/newspapers publish circulation figures, other markets (eg Android/iPhone) publish sales figures.   Whats the big secret?  

I suspect the number of sales is less than 1,000.

[Warmbrak]

A lot more than you're privvy to is going on behind the scenes thanks to a joint effort between several entities.

Excellent! Any clues as to what these are?

It think the key-phrase that Cameron used here is "privvy to". Now where is that troll emoticon...

[Goran_M]

Why?  Would'nt release of this information be a good thing for XP?

I'm sure many FSX devs would be very interested to know the size of the XP market.  This might encourage more FSX devs to take XP more seriously.

Magazines/newspapers publish circulation figures, other markets (eg Android/iPhone) publish sales figures.   Whats the big secret?  

I suspect the number of sales is less than 1,000.

Wow, umm, ok...

The iPhone and Android sales figures have nothing to do with a developers sales figures.  You're talking about billion dollar corporations.  

As an exercise, ask PMDG how many units of the 744 they sold.  See what kind of response you get.

Then come back and we'll continue.

[MatthewS]

Wow, umm, ok...

The iPhone and Android sales figures have nothing to do with a developers sales figures.  You're talking about billion dollar corporations.  

As an exercise, ask PMDG how many units of the 744 they sold.  See what kind of response you get.

Then come back and we'll continue.

Regarding Android market you can look at downloads for 'paid only' apps or even unlock keys.  For example,

https://market.android.com/details?id=mobi.beyondpod.unlockkey&feature=search_result

As the Google refund policy is refund only within 15 mins of purchase the download numbers are representative of actual purchases.

PMDG's sale figures are not going to convince FSX devs to target XP.  The CRJ-200 figures might.  

[MatthewS]

It think the key-phrase that Cameron used here is "privvy to". Now where is that troll emoticon...

Sure, but this joint venture has not even been announced.  How many times do business ventures 'fail to launch', very often.

But yes it will be very interesting to hear more details of this project.

[Goran_M]

Matthew

I think discussing any kind of "figures" with anyone is very unprofessional and in very bad taste.  ASKING for sales figures is even worse. 

What's good for one (Android and iphone apps) is not necessarily good for the other (X Plane devs). 

PMDG are now so revered by the MSFS community that if they decided to develop for FlightGear, everyone would follow them.  They could make a flying fridge for x-plane for iphone and sell heaps.  There is a LOT more riding on a developers decision on whether or not to migrate from one platform to the other than just sales figures.  And even if they want sales figures, they can get them confidentially through some kind of mediation.

Please, stop digging.  All we ask of people is that they enjoy what we create.  I can't speak for devs over at the org, but over here, we're exploiting every single facet of aircraft development to bring some damn realistic stuff.  We don't tell everyone everything and there is a reason for that.  The CRJ is just the beginning. 

[tkyler]

I have to say that agree or disagree with Matthew, his words are well chosen and articulate and just the kind of thing I like to see here.   He has been misquoted and misunderstood at least four times in this thread that I can count and his statement,  "you should read what I wrote more carefully" is right on the money!!  

Xplane has nothing on the market that can compare with PMDG...true!

X-Plane is a small market with (thus far) little return compared to the MSFS market....true!

Nothing wrong with asking how many sales...and nothing wrong with telling him it's none of his business.

Matthew has never said that x-plane devs could not attain what PMDG has...he's only speculated doubt that they will..and probably not because of anyone's lack of ability, but rather other factors like market size, incentive, and a few other factor, etc.   Statistically, it's a reasonable argument but not one my personality subscribes to.  I won't fault Matthew for it, but neither will I be bound by it.  

Flight will probably gain a very sizable following because MS have legions of followers and a 25+ year history of development.   The man-hours put into that franchise is staggering and probably 10x or more what x-plane has into it.  The fact that x-plane is even in consideration in discussions of flight sim is something to be proud of as we've accomplished a lot more with a lot less.

There is NO WAY to know how things will unfold.  x-Plane has a smoothness to it's flight model that even though some argue, there's no doubt that x-plane market is growing and growing and if you ask people their "switch" stories, it usually has to do with the "smoothness" and "fluidity" of the flight model.  If Flight doesn't address that aspect, then they'll still be operating with a void.  If they close that hole up and still allow realistic simulation..systems and all, it will be a tough act to follow.  I switched because of the "feel" of x-plane and if I had feel AND systems AND scenery...what else can you ask for?  Now that we're "fans" of x-plane and want it to succeed, lets hope Flight doesn't have it all.  For those that only want a great sim and don't care who provides it....you can't fault them....as for me?  I'm emotionally attached.

[TedG]

There is NO WAY to know how things will unfold.  x-Plane has a smoothness to it's flight model that even though some argue, there's no doubt that x-plane market is growing and growing and if you ask people their "switch" stories, it usually has to do with the "smoothness" and "fluidity" of the flight model.  

Bingo! That, "scaleability", and stability across 3 OS's are also major factors.

I enjoy both XP and FSX...but have come to favor XP over FSX for the above reasons. The singular exception being flying the Aerosoft DH-6 over ORBX scenery  .

What does make me chuckle a bit in reading through the thread is how it's all about PMDG realism and jets. Personally I prefer smaller props and actual flight as opposed to "push butan program FMC hit AP at 1500' AGL" system modelling. I don't care in the slightest which sim has the best model of "turn on IRS to align and wait 15 minutes or its not accurate simming".

Lulz  :.

I am pretty sure I am not the only one in this catagory of virtual piloting either.

This is not a bad discussion to read though and more civilized than most XP-v-MSFS threads floating around the fora.

[dpny]

If I were a serious MSFS user, this would make me very, very nervous. And the part which would scare me the most is the last section.

[MaidenFan]

When XP starts getting an abundance of CRJ level stuff and a more serious and mature market, MSFS is going to hurt. XP is for Mac, Windows, and Linux, while FSX is only for Windows. Throw in XP's flight model and I see much more potential for X-Plane...