First flight and impressions

[skypara]

Dear Javier and team,

The CRJ-200 is a fine product indeed, with a very few issues that need to be addressed.

Here's mine impression after a few hours with the machine:

A well done external modeling, very nice interior as well.

I am more that pleased with the cockpit lights.

The functionality of the cockpit is on a more than satisfactory level.

The fact that Navigraph is having updates already means the FMS won't be just for decoration. Very nice!

I can't really comment on the flight model as I have never flown the CRJ in real life but it looks good to me.

Furthermore - minor imperfections and glitches such as the funny operation of the thrust reverser I believe can be fine tuned and fixed relatively quick.

I am finding difficulties to control certain values with the mouse drag - such as altitude changes - requiring me to drag like crazy through the whole screen. I would like the option of mouse wheel to change the values without dragging to be implemented.

Something I would like to stress on - this great product badly needs a sound package update. The average quality of the CRJ does not match the poor sounds that are attached to it.

I kinda expected this to be frank, and I am sure it is something to be worked on in the future. Unfortunately for me the sounds are a major NoGo item and it looks like I would keep the CRJ in the hangar for a time being until a sound update is published or a solution to upgrade the sounds with a package like Turbine Sound Studios products for FSX is found.

This product has really a great potential and might divert more people to X-Plane from FSX, but sure it needs some refinements to be done first.

Best regards,

[Japo32]

Hi!!

well first I must say that it surprises to me that opinion about the sounds.. I believe I tried to find the best I could on default sounds. Maybe the starting engines blackout are not so good, but the rolling over the runway and others.... I liked them!!

Anyway.. there are plans to improove that one.

About the mouse manipulation. This aircraft (as others) is made with manipulator technology. ON drag manipulations it considers your camera position to determine which is x,y,z so if you move your camera with trackir or whatever from a different point where it should be (pilot near seat) then you will have problems manipulating it.. because on one position it was a +x movement to the right and in other camera position is an -x to the left.

Nothing it can be done there until x-plane makes something different with it.

about the thrust reversers it is discussed on other topic.

cheers,

[StevenM]

First impressions after the tutorial flight. Didn't read all manuals yet.

I'll skip the good points since they would take to much screen space   (nice plane!)

Some little things i noticed:

- APU sound is either low quality or the apu on the crj just sounds strange.

- Reversers (as noticed by others)

- On my CH Quadrant throttle, I could push the right engine through it's "performance limits". I was redlining constantly.

- Personally I find the drag buttons for the nav-source, map range and mfd modes not user friendly. Maybe a cycle button would be better.  

- I could not get two popups next to each other (probably a case of rtfm).

[philipp]

- Reversers (as noticed by others)

please refer to this topic: http://forums.x-pilot.com/index.php?topic=2102.0

Reverser toggle will be no problem when your joystick input on the throttle axis is exactly 0%. Please confirm calibration

- On my CH Quadrant throttle, I could push the right engine through it's "performance limits". I was redlining constantly.

As long as you don't set a thrust limit, you can push the engine into redline. As expected.

- Personally I find the drag buttons for the nav-source, map range and mfd modes not user friendly. Maybe a cycle button would be better.  

Maybe a question of personal preferences. If there is sufficient interest, I'm sure Javier can make cycle buttons (like the flap lever).

- I could not get two popups next to each other (probably a case of rtfm).

You can drag them all with the mouse.

Philipp

[StevenM]

About the thrust levers, afaik i did set the thrust limit as explained in the tutorial to 90.5%.

I had both two of the thrust levers at the same position, on my CH throttle and in the models throttle but the right engine

was redlining while the left one stayed within limits.

FYI the CH Quadrant has six levers, normally used for throttles,mixture and pitch.

[philipp]

Thanks for info.

I will set up my Saitek throttles and give it a try.

[signmanbob]

Although I haven't had a chance to get in it yet, I certainly hope that Turbine Sound can come up with a sound addon for this.

Default sounds just don't cut the mustard with high end payware aircraft.  Sounds have to be as high in quality as the aircraft.  They are half of the experience.  You put the flightplan in the FMC, fiddle with a few knobs, then sit back and listen to the sounds for a couple of hours.

With FSX, I've been lucky enough to be able to purchase Turbine sounds for Level D 767, PMDG and Captain Sim.

I hope now that the bar is being raised for X-Plane, some payware sounds will become available.

[Kesomir]

That I don't really understand. While the default x-plane sound engine is used, loads of the sounds are customised. I noticed that straight away.

WHat we really need is an upgrade to x-planes sound rather than relying on diffferent roll your own solutions that don't work reliably across platforms.

[Ben Russell]

The last two Laminar Sound Engine upgrades I can remember are;

1 - The avionics fan and dedicated volume slider for it.

2 - The mouse click sample, which is just insane.

[karingka]

I have read the manual, and I noticed the mention of NO auto speed control before I bought the aircraft. Now I really realized, that no AT/HR is included! So the pilots actually have to manage the speed the whole way?

[flyinhawaiian]

I have read the manual, and I noticed the mention of NO auto speed control before I bought the aircraft. Now I really realized, that no AT/HR is included! So the pilots actually have to manage the speed the whole way?

Yeah, crazy concept, eh?  A pilot actually has to fly a plane rather than just push some buttons!  :

[skypara]

With the initial note that I am not a sound expert of any kind,

I've been digging in the CRJ sound folders last night and found out an interesting fact - the engine sound files are actually only 4, while in FSX folders you can find sometimes more than 12.

It appears that X-Plane has different way of presenting the sounds (tune up or down the same files for idle to max thrust) and unfortunately the final result is worse than FSX. This being said I have changed the APU and few other sound files with my sounds library from FSX and the final result is... not bad  :-\ I need to get accustomed to the X-Plane specifics I presume.

[Japo32]

Really! I don't know what is happening to you with the sounds. I made as other planes and I put the special treatment to make then sweet. On my computer they sound like heaven ( strong and noise outside, calm inside like is supposed to be).

There are 4 sounds on resources.. but are not the different stages, but inside, outside, properllers, jets.. etc... This plane only uses jets...

Anyway.. there is a plan to make custom sounds with plugin on future.. but for now I wouldn't say the sounds are ugly. Maybe you are me are listening different sounds... Maybe configuration.. maybe I am deaf and I discover it now!!! hahaha

no.. really.. don't know what is that about... maybe a video would help to understand it.

Thanks!

[Lukasz]

As far as sounds go, there is also a substantial difference in playback quality between computers, with regards to hardware installed, drivers version and specific configuration. It's the same matter, as with graphics, but it is less obvious. You won't get "low framerate" with sounds (extreme cases aside); the playback will be smooth, but with degraded or distorted quality. Also some people are more sensitive for small differences in sound (like musicians), than others, which will further influence the way they hear them. For example, I hate tuning up sound equalizers, usually it looks like "an hour into the work and I'm still not satisfied"

[mutestyles]

Thats is strange because the sounds they give out on my computer are way better than anyother x plane Release for sure.

[flyinhawaiian]

Thats is strange because the sounds they give out on my computer are way better than anyother x plane Release for sure.

Same, I was very happy with the way the sounds played on my computer.  Startup was a little funky, but smoothed out, and I noticed a little phase imbalance in-flight, but I was also working in other windows on my computer at the same time, so it could have been induced...

[Japo32]

So maybe here we are talking about an issue with the sound on some computers. Maybe drivers... maybe hardware. It is more difficult to find what others are hearing. On visuals is easy because you post a picture and that is ok... but on sounds.. maybe videos?

[ARTIK]

Sure as an evil I've started the whole "sound crusade" as they called it on the xplane10 blog but with good intentions! CRJ deserve the high quality sound simulation:

1) modern sound architecture (plugin)

2) good quality recordings 16bit/44.1kHz

3) clever sound design

1+2+3=success

I know it's not easy to record original sounds in optimal pro quality, record for soundpack creation in mind. It's not possible without the knowledgeable sound engineers on location and the sound designers extracting the sounds and building multilayered compositions...

I can understand the release of CRJ was too early for doing plugin adaptation and all the sound design work. But the designers had permission to use the well known sound plugin used on some choppers and on my PFC Bonanza/Baron soundpacks.

I like ironic Ben comment about the latest greatest upgrades to the X-Plane sound architecture made by Laminar... sad truth. We're underdeveloped by decades in X-Plane sound department. FSX has quite modern architecture built in the sim, at least 2 fine GUI applications helping in airplane sound design. It's a huge thing. Sorry but I suspect Austin is quite deaf.   

My opinion about the sound playback on different computers:

Each Mac sounds the same, very good quality D/A converters, system drivers work just as they should, no way we can complain. Just listen to the CD Audio, no distortions, sounds fine even for the pro. I don't think PC drivers are so bad (I'm using ASUS 8channel motherboard outputs. Similar to the Mac sound quality). The problem lies in speaker systems... The quality varies widely! Way more than in LCD monitors.

regards

arti

 

 

[woweezowee]

Arti, I'm a professional in the music biz. I can relate to what you are talking about. But in any case, what I see on top of the list is for XP10 is wheather, ATC, 64bit. But sure I'll say this: If there was a good sound system in xplane I'd use my monitoring speakers more often - definately. As it is right now standard speakers suffice completely.

[Japo32]

I can understand the release of CRJ was too early for doing plugin adaptation and all the sound design work. But the designers had permission to use the well known sound plugin used on some choppers and on my PFC Bonanza/Baron soundpacks.

It will be great if you work on sounds... but I believe being 2 years and a half of continous work I don't call it too early!!!  

believe me it was released on the right moment.... Now or never (I know this veeeeeeeery well)

[ARTIK]

Maybe it was badly expressed or I was misunderstood...

I appreciate your long team work and actual CRJ release.

I think your team was too busy with system modeling to work in parallel on the plugin based sound architecture... So let's try to make step by step improvements.

[Japo32]

sure! and it will be appreciated!  

[thiengo]

PC12 in the shade tree project, my favorite, until you leave the CRJ200 and 100% functional with all available datarefs,. They have two versions of acf, a Normal Condition for the Power Level and another that detects the positioner lever and keep the 12% I think, of the joystick to reverse. not apply to this project, since the reverse lever is different, however, we could have a dataref with the amplitude of an analog axis, where reading a potentiometer (analog input) eviaríamos this value to the shaft and a reverse button idle detent position, so we could confirm throttle at idle through notch. for home use without a cockpit, the possibility exists for the reverse link to a joystick axis?

[Japo32]

Thiengo... I think you are talking about the reversers problem.... well they are fixed in next version. We still have to wait a little to see it outside.