New issue with installation to latest build

[BillM]

Hi, other than my virus checker giving me issues with the installation (which I have resolved) I have never had any other issues until today. After download and during installation I get this error:

 

Tried three times with same result.

In addition, with latest Xplane version, I go from 40 FPS with all of the default aircraft to 9-12 FPS. When I first bought it, I could get around 25-30 FPS.

It is all but unusable for me now - I was hoping latest version would help - but no joy as I cant install it.

Kind Regards, Bill

[RobW05]

Have you had xplane running before you did the update? 

Don't know why, but with some earlier updates i had similar  problems with the installer when running it right after closing xplane. Restarting the PC did the trick in these cases. 

[Cameron]

@BillM You're using an old installer.

[BillM]

Hi,

No problem with Xplane - still works well.

I downloaded the installer an hour before I posted issue.

Has new installer just been released? If not, then I am using latest  installer. 

I also suffered very poor FPS with last TBM900 version.

Bill.

[Goran_M]

The poor FPS is not the TBM. It’s the new X-Plane update. Turn your threaded optimisation on in your graphics card settings. Your FPS should return. 

Edited January 17, 2019 by Goran_M

[BillM]

Hi,

Thanks for your suggestions.

I have tried threaded optimisation on and off - still poor FPS. With all other aircraft I can achieve 35-40 FPS.

Still can't install - any other ideas? 

[BillM]

As I was desperate, I re-downloaded the executable and now I get this (after 3 tries):

This is getting as bad as some of my experiences with FSX.

If the FPS and the installation issues cannot be fixed, can someone in support please give me a refund?

Regards,

Bill.  

[Goran_M]

Let's try to calm down a minute, Bill.  We're on your side.  

Do you have any leftover files or folders from the TBM in the Aircraft/X-Aviation folder?

If so, delete them, then reinstall.

As for the FPS, nothing was changed that could affect the performance to the extent you're experiencing.  Only minor tweaks were done to get rid of previous bugs.  Can you try adjusting your settings.  11.3 has quite a few graphical updates, including a new particle system, that can affect fps.

Edited January 19, 2019 by Goran_M

[BillM]

Hi,

I am very calm but frustrated.

When you spend more time trying to get a product to work than you do using it, then frustration sets in and you question the value of the product.

I will try and look for any remnants of a previous installation and remove them and then I will try and re-install again.

From these forums, I do not appear to be only person having issues. Seeking complexity and realism can be problematic for any product and particularly one for Xplane with its regular updates - so I sympathise with your position.

I am a pilot and have been involved in simulation ( professional and entertainment) for over 30 years - getting accessibility and realism balanced is very difficult. Whilst I understand your need for product protection, the process that you employ is a bit cumbersome and maybe part of the issues being highlighted.

In conclusion, I will try a bit longer with the TBM900 as I recognise its potential. However,  I use Xplane as for its accessibility and the fact that it does not need the constant tweaking that plagued FSX - I don’t want to then move to ‘the teaking’ to trying to get a product to work. As before, I welcome suggestions / advice on how to get this product to work and to enjoy the immense amount of work that has obviously gone into it.

Regards, Bill.

[fireone]

These things are useful when troubleshooting 

A log.txt

A detailed description of events leading up to the problem and what has been tried to solve it

A sense of equanimity and patience 

 

Goran has been tireless on these forums since the TBM was released .

He will help ,  as will other forum members where possible.

The TBM is worth the effort , we'll get you back behind her controls and into the wild blue yonder , no worries.

 

[Goran_M]

1 hour ago, BillM said:

Hi,

I am very calm but frustrated.

When you spend more time trying to get a product to work than you do using it, then frustration sets in and you question the value of the product.

I will try and look for any remnants of a previous installation and remove them and then I will try and re-install again.

From these forums, I do not appear to be only person having issues. Seeking complexity and realism can be problematic for any product and particularly one for Xplane with its regular updates - so I sympathise with your position.

I am a pilot and have been involved in simulation ( professional and entertainment) for over 30 years - getting accessibility and realism balanced is very difficult. Whilst I understand your need for product protection, the process that you employ is a bit cumbersome and maybe part of the issues being highlighted.

In conclusion, I will try a bit longer with the TBM900 as I recognise its potential. However,  I use Xplane as for its accessibility and the fact that it does not need the constant tweaking that plagued FSX - I don’t want to then move to ‘the teaking’ to trying to get a product to work. As before, I welcome suggestions / advice on how to get this product to work and to enjoy the immense amount of work that has obviously gone into it.

Regards, Bill.

There's no need to get to the frustrated level.  If it didn't work, post in here.  I certainly wouldn't wait until I reached the end of my tether to make a post.  

And just to clarify, the number of people having these issues represent less than 1% of our customer base.  With complex aircraft comes problems on SOME PC's.  There are countless PC configurations, X-Plane installations with who knows what kinds of plug ins are installed, that can be the cause of any number of bugs.  Bugs happen.  No software is immune to them.  Not even an iphone.  The latest X-Plane update crushed fps in X-Plane, but a number of people blamed the TBM.  They realized it was the sim when, at my suggestion, they tried another add on.  

We understand you and the problems you're having.  In return, we ask you to understand us.  We don't know how frustrated you are.  We don't know what lengths you went to.  It's not our intention to make you frustrated.  And most problems can be sorted out with a few seconds of work from the end user.  Just ask the question and give us any files we need.  As @fireone said, I'm always here.  Even if I'm on vacation, I'll respond to questions within 24 hours.  Usually within 12 hours.  

[BillM]

Good news!

As advised, cleaned all folders and files ref TBM900.

No problem with installation and my FPS are also restored - around 25FPS (from 9!)

May I suggest that you give the user the option to completely remove TBM900 or leave various config files - this change may improve user experience and reduce support questions.

Back to flying and not tweaking!

Thanks for your assistance.

Bill.

[BillM]

I was premature!

Selected aircraft, good FPS, tutorial started, go as far as engine start and then Xplane crashed.

Re-started Xplane, new situation, selected TBM900 aircraft, into cockpit FPS back to 9, and battery will not switch on - checked all systems, they were OK.

Selected Cessna 172, everything was okay, FPS back to 40 plus.

Sorry, but this is a pain.

Added 3 x log files - are there any others you need?

TBM900_Log.txt

Log.txt

GizmoLog.txt

Here are the four files in the OPutput TBM900 state folder:

state.cfg

creds.cfg

883d79ba31e8d403bada1a24793a97f2_maintlog.csv

883d79ba31e8d403bada1a24793a97f2.airframe

I will give it a few more days of trying to get it running.

Kind Regards,

Bill.

[Cameron]

I would venture to say that running the GTX 970 could be a big contributing bottleneck here. That's a pretty old card by today's standards when coupled with the demands of X-Plane 11. My guess would be some kind of fill rate happening on the card.

[BillM]

Hi Cameron,

I have two GTX970 in my PC and to date, have had no issues with any sims and other complex aircraft in Xplane.

However, I will be getting a new RTX 2080 in a month or so as I agree that those cards are getting a bit old.

Regards,

Bill

[Cameron]

SLI configs like that can actually do more harm than good when it comes to X-Plane. It was never really optimized to take advantage of it and when SLI was the big thing it wasn't uncommon to see single cards beating out performance of dual cards.

Trying to compare other aircraft to another really isn't a valid comparison. No two 3D models are alike, and the TBM obviously goes the extra mile in the programming department, which in turn is going to put more load on even the GPU. Given your description of when your fps hit starts, I'd say it's pretty clear what's likely going on.

[BillM]

Further to my last - I cleared the TBM900 state folder, by-passed the tutorial and finally had a short flight with good FPS (25-30).

I think you have two issues (that affect some people):

1. The un-install code does delete some files that then subsequently causes issues with the next installation or update.

2. There is something wrong in the state folder.

It will be intersesting whether I now again suffer issues or poor FPS as the state folder will have been updated - if yes, I will delete the contents again.

It is an impressive aircraft when I get it flying - however, ground handling is very sensitive and the aircraft requires a lot of trimming.

Kind Regards,

Bill.

[BillM]

After the successful flight yesterday, when I loaded the aircraft again today, I was back 9-10 FPS and it was unusable.

I closed Xplane and deleted the state folder, restarted Xplane, reloaded TBM900 and was back up tp 25-35FPS.

Unfortunately, 5 minutes into my flight and Xplane crashed.

This issue is unique to the TBM900.

I will wait for the next update to TBM900 and hopefully a fix, but for the moment, it is unusable for me.

There are problems with your uninstall routine and the 'state folder'.

I have attached log files to assist you. 

TBM900_Log.txt

Log.txt

GizmoLog.txt

Any suggestions welcomed - I just want to fly the aircraft!

Kind Regards,

Bill.

 

Log.txt

[Cameron]

The Uninstaller is NOT supposed to remove or touch the state folder by design. You are incorrect with that statement.

[BillM]

Cameron,

I am trying to assist you to correct a fault that I have - I have taken the trouble to provide you with  information and txt files; please don’t be so defensive, I appreciate this is ‘your baby’.

Fact: the uninstall routine leaves lots behind.

Fact: removing the state folder after each flight restores the FPS from around 9 to approx 30

When I can get the aircraft flying - it is a joy.

Have you reviewed the files that I provided to determine the issues or the crash?

If we can’t work together to resolve the issue, then I will uninstall it and you can provide me with a refund.

Kind Regards,

Bill.

[Cameron]

3 hours ago, BillM said:

please don’t be so defensive, I appreciate this is ‘your baby’.

I'm not being defensive. I'm setting the record straight for something you said was incorrect. Your assessment of what should be removed is incorrect. State files are to be left intact for a reason. The whole simulation is based on the perpetual state of the aircraft. The installer does not uninstall these for reason, and it never will.

This is not my baby. It is Saso and Goran's baby.

3 hours ago, BillM said:

Fact: the uninstall routine leaves lots behind.

No, it really does not. Any core files that were installed with the product and are pertinent to making any of the code the aircraft uses are entirely removed minus the state of aircraft files.

3 hours ago, BillM said:

Have you reviewed the files that I provided to determine the issues or the crash?

That is not something I'm going to be able to assist you with. Goran and Saso will do so. Only advice I can provide to you is to remove all plugins minus Gizmo and see how you go.

3 hours ago, BillM said:

If we can’t work together to resolve the issue, then I will uninstall it and you can provide me with a refund.

Since you seem to be unfamiliar, please do familiarize yourself with our refund policy.

I'm sure Goran and Saso will do whatever they can to help you. FPS are not a guaranteed quantity, however. You already know my feelings on your GTX 970's.

[fireone]

When things go awry , I've in the past download a new copy of Xplane . In the case of the TBM I used this fresh copy  of XP and the only add on is theTBM. 

No added scenery , plugins , payware however benign they may seem. Saves a lot of time and hassle . 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2019 by fireone

[BillM]

Hi Fireone,

Thank you for your suggestion.

As I only have an issue with the TBM900 (all my other aircraft, stock and addons work very well) I would be reluctant to do a completer re-install.

I did use the Xplane application to check my installation and it did not highlight any problems. 

However, the few plugins that I have I will try and remove them and see what happens.

Kind Regards,

Bill.

[Goran_M]

6 hours ago, BillM said:

Hi Fireone,

Thank you for your suggestion.

As I only have an issue with the TBM900 (all my other aircraft, stock and addons work very well) I would be reluctant to do a completer re-install.

I did use the Xplane application to check my installation and it did not highlight any problems. 

However, the few plugins that I have I will try and remove them and see what happens.

Kind Regards,

Bill.

You don't have to do a complete reinstall.  Just install the sim with no scenery. 

I have no idea what other add ons you have, but no 3rd party add on is completely free of issues.  Particularly when X-Plane has several 3rd party plug ins installed.  There will always be a conflict somewhere until it's sorted out by the developer.  Looking at your log, I can see a few plugins that may be giving you issues.  But I'll wait for you to post back after taking them out before saying anything more on that.

[fireone]

One thing I learned from these forums early on, ( I don't recall if it was Goran or Cameron ), is there are two ways of removing plugins . The best way is to completely remove them from the XP installation. The second way is to rename them but leave them in the same location  . I used to use the second method. I don't anymore.