Tom Knudsen Posted May 2, 2014 Report Posted May 2, 2014 This I cannot understand, it totally blows my mind and I will not even begin to figure it out. Why to community sites that I would imagine serve the flight simulator community go an ban their own members. Ok, I see the issue if there is a strong violation of attacking persons or breaking the law. But banning members without any cause is to me fundamentaly wrong. So first I got banned from X-Plane.org, but thats what I had to pay for starting xp-developer.org. But today when reading the second latest blogg by Ben Supnik I visit the X-Plane review link and got this message So I wonder, how the heck could one get banned from such a site? Did I read the review wrong or did I comment a review in a negative fashion. My question would be, what could they possible be earning by banning members? Lets tank about real reasons for banning, in my mind every site should have at least a good portion of common sence, and If the violation is so harsh that it needs to be adressed, hell give the member a fare chance to explain him self. If the offender repetes him self, well then ban him. Reasons I would imagine could qualify for banning * Personal attacks on character * Repeted trolling the site/forum * Spamming * Hacking, spoofing, phising, immicing etc. * Serious violations for forum rules such as religion, sex, copyright etc. But hell, I must have done some horrible things in order to be banned from a review site LOL... Further more, when I started xp-developer.org I did not imagine the site would ever be a threat to anyone but more a useful resource for developers where they can discuss while developing. Intentions where not to capture or steal members from other places and as far as I know, the only serious place out there that acknowledge and understood this was x-pilot.com The same could not be said about xp-aviators.com and x-plane.org where I got banned instantly. Nevertheless, I am still live and kicking but more or less gobsmacked by these policies..
Cameron Posted May 2, 2014 Report Posted May 2, 2014 Not sure if you're aware, but the X-Plane Reviews site is actually funded by the owner of X-Plane.org. This may answer your question as to why you'd be banned there as well.
Tom Knudsen Posted May 2, 2014 Author Report Posted May 2, 2014 Thank you Camron, that explains it very well. Sure hope they aren't involved in other places
Leen de Jager Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 (edited) So first I got banned from X-Plane.org, but thats what I had to pay for starting xp-developer.org. Cannot find that anywhere Can find xp-developer.com ?? Must say I am visiting X-Plane .org for more than nine years now and I like the site.Once due to a misunderstanding I was banned for a couple of hours.A simple explanation by mail adressed to the management of X-Plane.org was enough to clear the sky. I am an administrator at AVSIM for many years and I can assure you , people can be banned there too ,if one does not follow the house-rules. Its possible one of the house rules is NOT advertising other X-Plane related websites.Personally I think thats not a good rule , on the other hand saying "its no good here and go there" one cannot tolerate.Many forumleaders are to sensitive and over-react. The best way to stay banned from a site is camplaining about it publicly on another site. Edited May 3, 2014 by Leen de Jager
captainamerican Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 This happened to me a few years back too. I got banned for posting a livery but the terms for that aircraft were not to mess around with liveries so I understood it, should have not tampered with the liveries. But seriously, i got banned for the livery, and i was not only banned from X-Plane.org but XPFW too. They take the smallest issues so seriously, I bet this is why many simmers still are hesitant to switch to X-Plane. Its like moving into North Korea!
Leen de Jager Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 (edited) I bet this is why many simmers still are hesitant to switch to X-Plane I can assure you it has nothing to do with X-Plane.Being active on forums (as well as in their management) who are dedicated to other sims as well, beleve me.Its the same everywhere.Not saying its bad everywhere, anyways it has nothing to do with the subjects of the fora , is all about the people at the rudder.Many fora are just like some banana-republics , they are led by small dictators. MINDSaying: Its like moving into North Korea!Thats something I personally do not tolerate on the Dutch forum of wich I am a moderator. ( NOT saying I do not agree with you!!)Our rules say : No politics. Thats why I used "some banana-republics" thats more general. edit=correcting my shabby english Edited May 3, 2014 by Leen de Jager
Tom Knudsen Posted May 3, 2014 Author Report Posted May 3, 2014 Cannot find that anywhere Can find xp-developer.com ?? Must say I am visiting X-Plane .org for more than nine years now and I like the site. Once due to a misunderstanding I was banned for a couple of hours. A simple explanation by mail adressed to the management of X-Plane.org was enough to clear the sky. I am an administrator at AVSIM for many years and I can assure you , people can be banned there too ,if one does not follow the house-rules. Its possible one of the house rules is NOT advertising other X-Plane related websites. Personally I think thats not a good rule , on the other hand saying "its no good here and go there" one cannot tolerate. Many forumleaders are to sensitive and over-react. The best way to stay banned from a site is camplaining about it publicly on another site. Sorry Lean, my bad and typo, .com it is I too have been at AVSIM for many years and seen my share of things. But thats properbly why tend to not understand trigger happy sobs. There is a fine balance i know, but if you are to host a community you need to have a larger ceilings, show members the respect they deserve and argue their actions when the are wrong. However majory violations should generate a warning for repeted offenders, but it is the moderators job to remove posts and threads that conflicts with the rules, not automatic ban a member for i.e doing something wrong. Nevertheless, I will not argue with the moderator team over at x-plane.org and the reason is simple and let me quote Mark Twain "Never argue with idiots, they just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience"
Jim Kallinen Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 Learned many years ago at the org site, to keep my opinions to myself. Oh yes, was banned there many times over the past 15 years. Cameron can spin a few good onesabout it. And few others. Would not loose any sleep over it though. Many other good sites to visit. Like here.
Leen de Jager Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 (edited) but it isthe moderators job to remove posts and threads that conflicts with the rules, not automatic ban a member for i.e doing something wrong. Yes Tom , it could not have been said it better.I hartfully agree. Removing the post.Warning and explaining for the poster.And then , when that does not help, banning. ( never a ban for life at the first incident is my policy )In that order ONLY. Leen editing = correcting my shabby english Edited May 3, 2014 by Leen de Jager 1
captainamerican Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 I can assure you it has nothing to do with X-Plane.Being active on forums (as well as in their management) who are dedicated to other sims as well, beleve me.Its the same everywhere.Not saying its bad everywhere, anyways it has nothing to do with the subjects of the fora , is all about the people at the rudder.Many fora are just like some banana-republics , they are led by small dictators. MINDSaying: Its like moving into North Korea!Thats something I personally do not tolerate or the Dutch forum on wich I am moderator. ( NOT saying I do not agree with you!!)Our rules say : No politics. Thats why I used "some banana-republics" thats more general.I understand. Sorry if I grind your gears, I didn't really mean anything about the X-Plane Simulator itself, "moving into North Korea" as in The X-Plane Forum itself and the heavy rules with it. But yet again, maybe I shouldn't say things like that (even though I think we all have freedom to say or comment whatever we like, unless its vulgar). Anyway I apologize.
sqrt(-1) Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 (edited) I understand. Sorry if I grind your gears, I didn't really mean anything about the X-Plane Simulator itself, "moving into North Korea" as in The X-Plane Forum itself and the heavy rules with it. But yet again, maybe I shouldn't say things like that (even though I think we all have freedom to say or comment whatever we like, unless its vulgar). Anyway I apologize. Contrary to common belief, rights to free speech do not apply to posts made on other people's websites. The owners of the websites and their agents have full discretion to control content. If you wish to "say or comment whatever [you] like", create your own website and have a good time. EDIT: Corrections and clarification. Edited May 3, 2014 by sqrt(-1)
Leen de Jager Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 (edited) rights to free speech do not apply to posts made on other people's websites. The owners of the websites and their agents have full discretion to control content. Thats it , not more, not less. edited due to my shabby english as usual. Edited May 3, 2014 by Leen de Jager
captainamerican Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 I am done arguing, I hope you all know I never meant this with any hostility. Lets all be friendly here!
sqrt(-1) Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 Lets all be friendly here! Agreed. There is no reason to be otherwise!
Mik75 Posted May 3, 2014 Report Posted May 3, 2014 (edited) I got banned from the org, because I said something negative about one of the addons I bought there on their forum. I got a refund, that was nice and happened really fast. But they told me that I had bashed the plane and that I couldn't have tested it long enough and therefore I got banned from the forum and the store. I bought 3 addons there before, with a total value of 165$, now it looks as if I wouldn't get anymore updates for my software, quite bad experience... Edited May 3, 2014 by Mik75
Tom Knudsen Posted May 3, 2014 Author Report Posted May 3, 2014 Theres a huge difference between critisim and condescending, to bad so many cannot tell them apart.
PierreLvx Posted May 4, 2014 Report Posted May 4, 2014 Tom, I regret that I have to jump on that thread to address what you said earlier about xp-aviators.com, because, after all, we are all guests here and I hate drama. Nonetheless, I run this site and I have NEVER been banned from any community. It would be highly biased to generalize from -your- experience. We must have different approaches, as I've never found myself in a situation where my activities/affiliations where a hinderance. We exchanged emails a few months back and I trust you understood you were *suspended* temporarily for repeated unsolicited promotion (you weren't fully aware of the rules at this time). Still, you're absolutely free to enjoy the forums, and we'd be happy to read you again! If you want the community as a whole to be healthy and thriving, lead and show the way 1
Darius Alexander Posted May 4, 2014 Report Posted May 4, 2014 (edited) . Edited May 4, 2014 by Darius Alexander
Darius Alexander Posted May 4, 2014 Report Posted May 4, 2014 Tom, I regret that I have to jump on that thread to address what you said earlier about xp-aviators.com, because, after all, we are all guests here and I hate drama.Nonetheless, I run this site and I have NEVER been banned from any community. It would be highly biased to generalize from -your- experience. We must have different approaches, as I've never found myself in a situation where my activities/affiliations where a hinderance.We exchanged emails a few months back and I trust you understood you were *suspended* temporarily for repeated unsolicited promotion (you weren't fully aware of the rules at this time). Still, you're absolutely free to enjoy the forums, and we'd be happy to read you again!If you want the community as a whole to be healthy and thriving, lead and show the way Oh. I think you may have run out of words with your little pretentious response. I think this might help you.
Kyle Sanders Posted May 4, 2014 Report Posted May 4, 2014 I may be a little bias on this seeing as I am the founder of XPA and close friends with Pierre, but what is "pretentious" or incomplete about his response? Best Regards, Kyle Sanders
Darius Alexander Posted May 4, 2014 Report Posted May 4, 2014 It's overly articulate when it isn't called for. He has the tendency to do that; like the one time he threatened me with BASELESS legal action: "Due to recent messages sent from your Facebook account to my personal account, including, but not exclusively, under the name of "Darius Tate", I am hereby warning you that further occurrences will be reported. Repeated slander of that nature equals harassment and may be met with legal action." But don't worry, he got SHUTDOWN. "Number 1: this is not harassment, as this is your first time emailing me PERSONALLY about the issue. In America, harassment is defined as unwanted attention, and you've just informed me that the attention is unwanted. So there goes your case of harassment. Number 2: Slander is defined as spreading false accounts, or rumors that are false, with the intent to defame. Seeing as I was speaking figuratively, you have no case. Also in cases of slander, it is required for you to prove monetary dmages that equates to your claims, and seeing as you have not acquired any monetary damages, that makes your case all the more baseless."
Darius Alexander Posted May 4, 2014 Report Posted May 4, 2014 (edited) . Edited May 4, 2014 by Darius Alexander
PierreLvx Posted May 4, 2014 Report Posted May 4, 2014 (edited) Oh that's a very smart move, Darius. Perhaps now you would expect me to share what to sent me back then? Well, that will not happen, and you may want to thank me on this one. That was clearly not a representation of you at your best. My post was directed towards Tom. No point in taking it out of context, and to take pride in distorting unrelated things you shouldn't be too proud of. UPDATE: Let me paste what Darius posted right above me, because he doesn't really seem to understand that editing doesn't wipe things out. Many of us will get an email notification with a copy of the post. Also Kyle, having bragging rights to being the founder of XPA....eh. Sorry, but that group is so far from what you originally envisioned it to be. Yeah, really smart to use X-Pilot to vent whatever kind of bitterness you may have. Edited May 4, 2014 by PierreLvx
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