Matei Posted January 15, 2021 Report Posted January 15, 2021 Hi, First of all I would like to tell you that I really enjoy your product. And I mean it. Unfortunately, the following part of the post will be a bit rougher... I read through the comments posted by other members, regarding the ILS problem. In reality this is a deal breaker, and maybe they use rougher language than they should, but especially the ones that bought the product recently, are extremely unhappy with this issue. First let me put this in perspective: The model costs about 65$, which is about the same price as the whole X-Plane game on Steam. That makes it relatively expensive. Some people argue that it is the most expensive GA aircraft. Can you see the reason why your (new) customers are angry that a very basic system is completely not working? Now, why am I actually bothered about this ILS problem: It is nowhere mentioned on the x-aviation website that the model is at the moment bugged. It is sold as per description, which is very comprehensive. In my opinion, as developers you had a couple of options to deal with such a problem: Remove temporarily the plane from sale. That would prevent angry new customers until the patch is out. Mention somewhere visible that the model has a problem and that a fix is in development, so that if an user decides to buy your product, at least he is informed about the situation. Had you done one of the things above, I would have been informed, and delayed my purchase. But I guess 65$ more for you is more important that satisfied customers. All that your customers want from you, is to know a approximate date for the real fix. Workarounds that affect the other airplanes form the game are not a solution. It would be nice, if you could make a post with the information regarding the expected patch date. Also, one of your remarks, is that we are "wasting time writing posts [...]", in reality we, the ones writing posts, are your customers and we are letting you know that your (expensive) product has a problem. Lastly, that paragraph 8 that you quoted is not holding true against European Electronic Commerce Law. All online purchased products are having a 14 days return policy or another form of quantification (Steam has 8h of product use, Google Play has something similar). Let me remind you that if you accept a purchase initiated from within EU, and having EU billing details, you have to respect the EU law irrespective of where the online shop is situated. Maybe you want to talk to somebody from x-aviation, because that clause might escalate sometime. Regards, Matei
Goran_M Posted January 16, 2021 Report Posted January 16, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Matei said: First of all I would like to tell you that I really enjoy your product. And I mean it. Thank you. 1 hour ago, Matei said: the following part of the post will be a bit rougher... And round and round we go. Ok, let's answer these...once more. 1 hour ago, Matei said: I read through the comments posted by other members, regarding the ILS problem. I hope you also read my responses. 1 hour ago, Matei said: In reality this is a deal breaker, and maybe they use rougher language than they should, but especially the ones that bought the product recently, are extremely unhappy with this issue. To be honest with you, I don't see this as a deal breaker at all. Actually, I hardly ever use the ILS. But to each his own. 1 hour ago, Matei said: The model costs about 65$, which is about the same price as the whole X-Plane game on Steam. Relatively cheap compared to some MSFS add ons in the same category. And also, when compared to most other GA's out there, the value for money (what you get out of it for the money invested) is there. 1 hour ago, Matei said: Can you see the reason why your (new) customers are angry that a very basic system is completely not working? Absolutely, which is why I would direct my anger at Navigraph, for making a change so drastic in their AIRAC, that it broke a simple system (which is in fact, quite heavily coded in the TBM to make it even better than default) 1 hour ago, Matei said: It is nowhere mentioned on the x-aviation website that the model is at the moment bugged. It is sold as per description, which is very comprehensive. By your reasoning, every single add on, in the entire fight sim market, needs to have a disclaimer that "This product is very likely to have issues. We will keep updating as the bugs are found." No software is bug free. None. Not even Operating Systems are bug free. Windows comes out with updates every month. Even the apps on my phone come out with regular updates. Now, if the TBM is actually unflyable, we will pull it from the store. But it is perfectly flyable, with the ILS not functioning. To remedy this, we have posted 2 workarounds to get it back until the update is out. 1 hour ago, Matei said: Mention somewhere visible that the model has a problem and that a fix is in development, so that if an user decides to buy your product, at least he is informed about the situation. Have you seen the comments in these forums? Aren't these enough? 1 hour ago, Matei said: Had you done one of the things above, I would have been informed, and delayed my purchase. But I guess 65$ more for you is more important that satisfied customers. No, because the vast majority of our customers are more than happy to wait for the update to the ILS. The number of people posting their anger in these forums represents less than 1% of our total TBM customer base. What's more important to us, is that the majority of our customers are happy with the product. We can't please everyone. No matter how hard we try. 1 hour ago, Matei said: All that your customers want from you, is to know a approximate date for the real fix. If you really want me to give you an approximate date, the fix will be out some time this year. I'm sorry I can't be more specific. We wanted it out last year, but making it work under all situations, and all operating systems, is not as easy as one might think. 1 hour ago, Matei said: Workarounds that affect the other airplanes form the game are not a solution. They are for most people. 1 hour ago, Matei said: It would be nice, if you could make a post with the information regarding the expected patch date. As soon as we make solid progress on the update (regarding librain), we will make a post about it, as well as send out a newsletter. 1 hour ago, Matei said: Also, one of your remarks, is that we are "wasting time writing posts [...]", in reality we, the ones writing posts, are your customers and we are letting you know that your (expensive) product has a problem. What makes you think we DON'T KNOW there is a problem. We knew as soon as it presented itself. We don't need constant reminders. Complaining about it just gets everyone anxious and frustrated. You've mentioned the price tag twice now. Do you not feel you're getting value for your money? 1 hour ago, Matei said: Lastly, that paragraph 8 that you quoted is not holding true against European Electronic Commerce Law. All online purchased products are having a 14 days return policy or another form of quantification (Steam has 8h of product use, Google Play has something similar). Let me remind you that if you accept a purchase initiated from within EU, and having EU billing details, you have to respect the EU law irrespective of where the online shop is situated. Maybe you want to talk to somebody from x-aviation, because that clause might escalate sometime. You are purchasing from an online store in the United States. X-Aviation is not affiliated with Google Play or Steam, so their terms of use don't apply here in any way. Have you complained to Steam or Google Play about only having 8 hours use instead of allowing 14 days as dictated by European Law? By all means, if you wish to file a reversal with your bank, you are free to do so, but under X-Aviations terms and conditions, which you agreed to when you created your account, this will leave you open to license cancellation on all your products and a ban from the store. Now, to close off. We are more than happy to work with people on any issues our products have. We have over 200 testers helping with the update. But to expect something on YOUR terms, without any idea of what it takes to create an update, is (for want of a better word) ignorance. We're not sitting on a beach, drinking margarita's by the pool. We're working, almost always, 7 days a week. The update is coming. And it will be available when it's ready. No sooner. Have a nice day. Edited January 16, 2021 by Goran_M
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