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KIAD HYPER7 Arrival missing fixes

crisk73

By crisk73
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crisk73 Newbie

crisk73

Posted
Posted (edited)

Hi, herewith to report an issue I've run into while flying my KJFK-KIAD leg on VATSIM. The controller gave me a constraint over a waypoint I wasn't able to find in the flightplan, with the Arrival-Transition-Approach already selected in the FMC. After I've found that the HYPER SEVEN arrival at KIAD is not correctly read by the FMC as some published waypoints (which were relevant to the above ATC instructions) are actually missing.

From point DELRO a straight line to COVUR is drawn for the ILS Rwy19C approach, while the fixes LIRCH, BINNS and HYPER are left out from the star depiction.

B733_1.jpg

KIAD_HYPER7.JPG

My flightplan: KJFK KENNEDY FOUR RBV.HYPER SEVEN ILS RWY19C KIAD - FL240

Using Aerosoft NavDataPro cycle 1802.

IXEG_FMS_debug.txt

Thanks for your attention.

Cris

Edited by Morten
crisk73 Newbie

crisk73

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Mmm.. Claude, good catch thanks! And I thought that Aerosoft worked better with the IXEG than Navigraph... I had previously flown the same leg with other aircraft (same navdata) and it worked fine. I'll check in the IXEG format if something is broken. Another reason to switch to Navigraph when my yearly Aerosoft subscription expires. ;)

Edit: wait... Claude. You selected the DELRO4 arrival. Would you please try with the HYPER7?

daemotron Collaborator

daemotron

Posted
Posted

@crisk73 maybe you could check the file "Aircraft\X-Aviation\IXEG 737 Classic\fmc_data\SidStar\KIAD.xml" - it describes the waypoints of the procedure and is read by the FMS. In the Navigraph file, the STAR you selected is defined like this: 

<Star Name="HYPER7.19C" Runways="19C">
      <Star_Waypoint ID="1">
        <Name>DELRO</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.965475</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-76.625344</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>0</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="2">
        <Name>LIRCH</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.826767</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-76.922231</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>14000</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="3">
        <Name>BINNS</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.785061</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-77.010994</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>0</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="4">
        <Name>HYPER</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.683933</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-77.225094</Longitude>
        <Speed>250</Speed>
        <Altitude>10000</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="5">
        <Name>COVUR</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.359072</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-77.453469</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>7000</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="6">
        <Name>DIMKE</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.309106</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-77.454383</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>0</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="7">
        <Name>HOOSR</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.226192</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-77.455597</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>0</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>

(skipping the transition part here). Can you check whether in the NavDataPro variant, the waypoints are defined in the same manner? Could also just be a semantic issue (tag not properly closed or similar), but I don't have the NDP files for comparison...

  • Upvote 1
crisk73 Newbie

crisk73

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

Thanks @daemotron for your help.

NavdataPro is structured differently, Runway Transition is set apart from the main STAR, but I don't see particular issues here: 

<Star Name="HYPER7" Runways="01C,01L,01R,19C,19L,19R">
      <Star_Waypoint ID="0">
        <Name>DELRO</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.965475</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-76.625344</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>0</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="1">
        <Name>LIRCH</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.826767</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-76.922231</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>14000</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="2">
        <Name>BINNS</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.785061</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-77.010994</Longitude>
        <Speed>0</Speed>
        <Altitude>0</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
      <Star_Waypoint ID="3">
        <Name>HYPER</Name>
        <Type>Normal</Type>
        <Latitude>39.683933</Latitude>
        <Longitude>-77.225094</Longitude>
        <Speed>250</Speed>
        <Altitude>10000</Altitude>
        <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
        <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
        <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
        <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
        <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
      </Star_Waypoint>
   <RunwayTransition Runway="19C">
        <RwyTr_Waypoint ID="0">
          <Name>COVUR</Name>
          <Type>Normal</Type>
          <Latitude>39.359072</Latitude>
          <Longitude>-77.453469</Longitude>
          <Speed>0</Speed>
          <Altitude>7000</Altitude>
          <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
          <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
          <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
          <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
          <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
        </RwyTr_Waypoint>
        <RwyTr_Waypoint ID="1">
          <Name>DIMKE</Name>
          <Type>Normal</Type>
          <Latitude>39.309106</Latitude>
          <Longitude>-77.454383</Longitude>
          <Speed>0</Speed>
          <Altitude>0</Altitude>
          <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
          <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
          <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
          <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
          <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
        </RwyTr_Waypoint>
        <RwyTr_Waypoint ID="2">
          <Name>HOOSR</Name>
          <Type>Normal</Type>
          <Latitude>39.226192</Latitude>
          <Longitude>-77.455597</Longitude>
          <Speed>0</Speed>
          <Altitude>0</Altitude>
          <AltitudeCons>0</AltitudeCons>
          <AltitudeRestriction>at</AltitudeRestriction>
          <Flytype>Fly-by</Flytype>
          <BankLimit>25</BankLimit>
          <Sp_Turn>Auto</Sp_Turn>
        </RwyTr_Waypoint>
      </RunwayTransition>

The fact is that those waypoints (LIRCH, BINNS, HYPER) are never used (or they get overwritten by other transitions) in the approach sequence.

Only devs know how the Approach code is interpreted by the FMC and if any issues exist either on IXEG or Aerosoft side.

Cris

Edited by crisk73
typo

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