I just pushed amerrir's Karma up one notch again. I think to keep the discussion going is fair enough. On the other hand, from my experience as editor in chief of a large music portal with a huge musicians and bands community, I want to tell you this concerning Javier's failure: We have a lot of votings going on ("best band overall, best live act, blabla..."), all reader's or peoples choices. Of course the musicians also create fake accounts. It's just too easy to cheat, even if you have a good opt-in system. If it happens in masses, they get disqualified. But there is no point in beeing resentful for a long time. One has to realize: That is part of user's behaviour in the net. I would be surprised if there were no other cheats in the .orgs votings other than the one by Javier. It is 100% NOT beliavable. He got caught, fair enough also. But like it or not: I bet all my money that in every single best of the month there is cheating going on. It's just common sense to know that. So, amerrir's point here is made on a false basis, while I still can see how one comes to the bad sentiments he feels. There has to come a point for you all to come over it. Either that, or both sides have to speak out COMPLETELY open. There is too much discussed about what happens "behind the scenes". Why is that thread there, why was the other one closed, for example. For us, who are really only pilots of x-plane, not running a site, not building scenery or planes, that's the thing both x-pilot and the org show that they rather exclude people in belief of building a community rather than include people. It's best to keep behind the scenes discussions behind the scenes, not hint at various things every other thread without getting to the point. Futhermore, I guess I am not the only one who is absolutely not interested in why amerrir and Cameron clash like that. Same thing: Speak out or both of you keep it to yourself or private discussions. Anything else just fails in producing joy with our hobby.