scotchegg Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 I'm very interested in the Panthera but I'm a bit disappointed in the cockpit textures of the Harranssor version. They don't look any better than the textures he used in the (admittedly excellent for freeware) Eclipse and not really up to recent payware standards (ref. Carenado). Having said that Mat yours looks like you've gone back to the drawing board so presumably it's going to take a very long time to get released? Quote
sqrt(-1) Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 They don't look any better than the textures he used in the (admittedly excellent for freeware) Eclipse and not really up to recent payware standards (ref. Carenado). To be fair, Harranssor's planes are also about a third cheaper than the average Carenado. Quote
brent123 Posted January 23, 2014 Author Report Posted January 23, 2014 I didn't want to diss Harranssor, but I do claim that our Panthera will be much more accurate since we're getting info from Pipistrel directly, I visited them, have constant contact with them... What bothers me is that he just came out with his Panthera all of the sudden. He saw the opportunity of our project being on hold and grabbed it. Can't blame him, though it still seems a bit unfair. But life is unfair so we must "swallow it" and go on. What do you guys think? Should we continue this project or just abandon it? Does it still have any sense if there's another Panthera, make another one? Probably, dissing this project means end of airplane development for me. It means a lot to me and I won't handle ending the work on it. I'm confused, mad and... I have no words. Sorry for the bitching and childish behaviour, I guess I really am just a child. Mat Quote
cruster Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 You either want to develop the airplane or you don't. If it's a passion, a drive you have, an itch that absolutely must be scratched, then it doesn't matter whether or not someone else released a competing package. Are you doing this as a means to make loads of cash? I'm guessing not, and besides pay-ware development is probably not the most lucrative form of modeling and programming. I've read lots of pay-ware developers posts where they claim they're not in it for the money; it's a labor of love. Maybe you're one of those, right? If that's the case, don't you feel compelled to ignore the competition and simply outperform and out-deliver them? I think I would. You sound like you're invested in your project. It appears you have the support of the real-world manufacturer. Why quit now? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD Quote
brent123 Posted January 23, 2014 Author Report Posted January 23, 2014 We're not doing it for cash, of course not. We're doing it because we planned to do it payware quality. We did start that way, we did too much work to just abandon it. The thing is that putting so much work and time for something, watching out for every piece of detail, make sure everything's going to be as the real thing, go to the people who DESIGNED the airplane, talk to them, get a lot of info etc... You start to question yourself: why? Why would I make another airplane like that, though more accurate, just for fun? We gave up on so many things just to give that time to the Panthera. It's hard to explain the feeling I have right now, I only had it one more time before. It's like being betrayed but in a different way. I sound like an idiot, I know. Mat Quote
brent123 Posted January 23, 2014 Author Report Posted January 23, 2014 One of the mods, can you please close the topic? It's off for an undecided amount of time. Mat Quote
ointment Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) Carenado doesn't seem to care that Jason Chandler made the same models of Pipers and Cessnas that they are selling and they continue to forge ahead with their development. Pete at SMS is building a Beaver even though STMA sells one. 4Forces is still upgrading their C152 even though Carenado sells one. I'm sure there are many other similar comparisons. You have no reason to stop development other than somebody stepped on your toes and hurt your feelings by releasing one first. You have no reason to feel "betrayed" in that you don't have a non-compete contract saying nobody else can build the plane you're working on. If yours is going to be so much better, you will still have a market when it is released. So get over it….pull up your boots and get back to work! Edited January 23, 2014 by ointment 1 Quote
sqrt(-1) Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 (edited) I didn't want to diss Harranssor, but I do claim that our Panthera will be much more accurate since we're getting info from Pipistrel directly, I visited them, have constant contact with them... What bothers me is that he just came out with his Panthera all of the sudden. He saw the opportunity of our project being on hold and grabbed it. Can't blame him, though it still seems a bit unfair. But life is unfair so we must "swallow it" and go on. What do you guys think? Should we continue this project or just abandon it? Does it still have any sense if there's another Panthera, make another one? Probably, dissing this project means end of airplane development for me. It means a lot to me and I won't handle ending the work on it. I'm confused, mad and... I have no words. Sorry for the bitching and childish behaviour, I guess I really am just a child. Mat There is no reason to diss a competitor. You also have absolutely no idea when he really started his interpretation of the Panthera. And even if he started it after yours, so what! In the real world there are often competing projects operating concurrently. That's life. Get used to it. We're not doing it for cash, of course not. We're doing it because we planned to do it payware quality. We did start that way, we did too much work to just abandon it. The thing is that putting so much work and time for something, watching out for every piece of detail, make sure everything's going to be as the real thing, go to the people who DESIGNED the airplane, talk to them, get a lot of info etc... You start to question yourself: why? Why would I make another airplane like that, though more accurate, just for fun? We gave up on so many things just to give that time to the Panthera. It's hard to explain the feeling I have right now, I only had it one more time before. It's like being betrayed but in a different way. I sound like an idiot, I know. Mat No one betrayed anyone here. If anything, you are betraying yourself by considering abandoning your project. Speaking for myself, I have no issue with purchasing multiple models of the same aircraft. For example, I have both payware PC-12s available for X-Plane. One is by STMA and the other by Michael Sgier. Both have their own distinct personalities and qualities. The same could very well be true with the Panthera. I would look at the bright side. Now you know exactly what you'll need to do to produce the better model. So, off to work you go! Edited January 23, 2014 by SqrtOfNegOne Quote
MdMax Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 What bothers me is that he just came out with his Panthera all of the sudden. He saw the opportunity of our project being on hold and grabbed it. Can't blame him, though it still seems a bit unfair. But life is unfair so we must "swallow it" and go on. The release of the Panthera by Harranssor was decided long before any project was on hold:http://www.x-plane.fr/showthread.php?t=52182&p=424972&viewfull=1#post424972 Quote
vsully Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 I'm buying yours… No offense but his looks like great freeware quality, not up to pay ware standards… DON'T GIVE UP NOW!!! Quote
DanielMyst777 Posted January 23, 2014 Report Posted January 23, 2014 I'm buying yours… No offense but his looks like great freeware quality, not up to pay ware standards… DON'T GIVE UP NOW!!!I loved his Diamond DA-42 Twin though. His implantation of the G-1000 was top notch with the new updates added to V. 1.2. This Panthera feels a bit recycled though with this avionics and, for sure, does not have that "Cerenado quality" GA plane vibe either...Hence I'll hold off on that purchase and see what this version has in store. I got all the time in the world now haha Quote
scotchegg Posted January 24, 2014 Report Posted January 24, 2014 (edited) To be fair, Harranssor's planes are also about a third cheaper than the average Carenado. I'm happy to spend a few extra dollars on a better looking cockpit, spending about 95% of my simming time in the VC as is my wont. What do you guys think? Should we continue this project or just abandon it? Does it still have any sense if there's another Panthera, make another one? From a personal point of view if you plan to populate your VC with realistic textures then please please please do, it'll be an automatic purchase for me. One of the most popular GA planes for FSX was (is) the Real Air Lancair Legacy because it's fast, feels good and looks damn good too (one of the most plausible cockpit environments for me because of the cockpit glass). The Panthera has a similar vibe to it so I think if you can make a good one it'll satisfy your professional pride as well as making some tidy beertokens as well. But please do make a decision and stick to it. Better to cancel it all together and perhaps inspire someone else to take it up rather than have it in perpetual back-burner status. Edited January 24, 2014 by scotchegg Quote
sqrt(-1) Posted January 24, 2014 Report Posted January 24, 2014 I'm happy to spend a few extra dollars on a better looking cockpit, spending about 95% of my simming time in the VC as is my wont. Agreed. If Brent gets it done and comes up with a better cockpit, I'll buy it. I have no issues paying up for quality. Quote
brent123 Posted January 24, 2014 Author Report Posted January 24, 2014 Thanks guys. I get offended and sad and and and very quickly... Sorry. I'd still stick to the original plan, realistic textures, up to 90% accuracy with systems and up to 99% accuracy with the model (since we got the original one that was used for simulation testing and Pipistrel's renders), a lot of options etc. But it's going to take min. 9 months to get it finished. It's hard to stick with the plan tho, with all of the obstacles in our way. It's about the mood as well, last few months I've been down and depressed (for personal reasons) and I couldn't do anything. The reason why I "unpaused" this project was the fear of being forgotten and then concealed by the Panthera by Harranssor. Me and Ilias decided to keep the project run at slower pace. Mat Quote
Hueyman Posted January 24, 2014 Report Posted January 24, 2014 Yes, just take it easy dude, don't base your whole life on this project, it's just for fun first, you can't play in the leader devs market at the age of 15, and I think it's a good think... When there is money involved, you never know what people can do to make you sink or earn as much as they can Be careful and just take it easy Quote
ilias.tselios Posted January 24, 2014 Report Posted January 24, 2014 Hi guys and ... from me! Looking only at our Panthera I will give you some clues what to expect. 1. About flight model. We are waiting to get the data from Pipistrel to work on that. We are looking for the most accuracy is possible. 2. Cockpit. We have done some preliminary work on cockpit object, but we are changing the textures you have see to a much higher detail, probably 5x. 3.On systems we have laid some basic plugin work (we will use SASL). But we are waiting for the 10.30 release which brings a new GPS to see what the possibilities are. In conclusion, we will go slow, but we will not sacrifice accuracy for any reason. 3 Quote
sqrt(-1) Posted January 24, 2014 Report Posted January 24, 2014 My wallet is out, credit card in hand... ..waiting for your announcement. 2 Quote
scotchegg Posted January 25, 2014 Report Posted January 25, 2014 (minimum) 9 months is a long time to wait but will keep a close eye on this one. If you could show some cockpit texture screenies when they're ready (doesn't need to be the whole cockpit) that would certainly help me keep a purchase of the Harnassor on hold. Mentioning things like rain effects / cockpit reflections would help even more:) Quote
brent123 Posted January 25, 2014 Author Report Posted January 25, 2014 Cockpit reflections will be included, we'll try to add rain/snow/other weather effects as well. We still have to discuss it though. Mat Quote
raven1982 Posted January 27, 2014 Report Posted January 27, 2014 Take your time. I purchased the other Panthera. It is nice but there are some flight dynamics that seem a little off compared to what I was told from a few gentlemen at Oshkosh this year. Overall it is a fun acf to fly around and test out. Like I did with the PC-12, when the time comes I will have both Pantheras in my stable and then decide which will stay. Quote
ryma Posted June 3, 2014 Report Posted June 3, 2014 (edited) For example, I have both payware PC-12s available for X-Plane. One is by STMA and the other by Michael Sgier. Both have their own distinct personalities and qualities. I also bought both versions. I regret the purchase at M. Sgier. For his version makes each time a DRM check. Offline fly does not work. No WiFi, no fly. The display remains black. Requests in the forum of X-Plane.org be deleted. Very strange circumstances in the forum of X-Plane.org. Edited June 3, 2014 by ryma Quote
sqrt(-1) Posted June 3, 2014 Report Posted June 3, 2014 I regret the purchase at M. Sgier. For his version makes each time a DRM check. Offline fly does not work. No WiFi, no fly. The display remains black. As I fly the Sgier PC-12 on a computer that is always connected to the Internet anyway, it is not that big a deal to me for the model to "phone home" to check the license once at each start-up. That said, Mr. Sgier indicated he was considering a different approach to DRM for a future version Quote
ryma Posted June 3, 2014 Report Posted June 3, 2014 (edited) I think most users do not even know that their plane phone home each time.He fails to mention this on his website. Edited June 3, 2014 by ryma Quote
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