Hydraulic Pressure Warning Light, Stuck On.

[Chuckfops]

Before purchase, I emailed to ask if this airplane was 10.20 64bit compatible. And was told that it was.

 

After purchase, I find, clearly, it is not.

 

First, I had to update the Airfoils in Airfoil-Maker just to get X-plane to stop crashing to desktop upon trying to load this plane. This is not even something that was mentioned to me upon inquiring about the airplane. It's not even included in the .zip package. It is something I stumbled across here on the forums. Which did work. Airplane loads now. But there are a couple of other clear issues.

 

I have read in other posts that users have had problems getting the airplane to a stop after taking off. Usually upon landing. In one thread someone suggests to delete a couple of the .prf files out of the preferences folder. I tried this, and almost fell for it working too. But then had the issue again soon after. It is my conclusion it has nothing to do with the .prf files at all. It is something with the airplane itself. If you choose a runway for a landing with any sort of wind to your back, even a 1-2 mph wind, the plane will just not stop, and then if you hit the grassy area, you can slide like this for hours, or until a crash.

 

Even before take off, if you get a little speed, with the wind to your back. You can forget about stopping. It almost seems like the jet motors at an idle are just a bit too high. Because I find, if you kill the engine, upon landing you can stop with no problems at all. So for me, I find myself touching down, hitting brakes and turning off the engines, in order to stop the aircraft.

 

That doesn't bother me much, I just role-play that the motors are super powered, and make the best of it.

 

What does drive me nuts though, is the Hydraulic Pressure Warning Light. It is stuck on. If you go to fails, you can clearly see Hydraulic 1 and 2 are having issues.. And it isn't something I can fix by entering the failure options of X-Plane. Everything shows as working in there. I cannot find a way to get this annoying light to shut off.

 

I don't mean to offend here, but for $20.00, and the fact I tried to cover my own ass by email before purchase. These things should be in working order upon download. Not after scouring the forums, troubleshooting to a great extent, and then coming here to beg for help to fix issues, I know you know, are broken.

 

There is a couple other threads, where someone was having this same Hydraulic Pressure Warning Light issue, and I seen they were told there is a version around, where this light is fixed. How might I find this version? And why is it not the version a person receives after sending you moneys?

 

This airplane has a lot of potential, but it is in a dire need of some updating before going out the door to any X-plane v10 customers.

 

CB

 

 

[Chuckfops]

So, I emailed the creator again, since he ignored my first email. Here was my reply.

 

 

"Hi!

 

sorry for the delay answering... Well.. the hydraulic pressure makes any problem to you piloting the plane? It is default msg one, I guess nothing to worry about. The only thing you need is to set the number of flight solutions per frame from 1 to 2 or 3 in this aircraft."

 

So there we go. I guess the warning light sticking on is more our problem(the consumer) than theirs(the creator).

 

I guess it is nothing to worry about. lol!

[Mario Donick]

I guess it is nothing to worry about. lol!

 

Calm down.

 

 

I assume you have pressed the two buttons which activate the hydraulic system in the overhead panel (see page 19 of the manual) and started your engines successfully?

 

If you did, no HYD warning light should be visible. I have just confirmed this in my Jetstream before answering your post.

 

What do the hydraulic gauges in the centre console show?

 

 

Regarding the speed issue: Don't forget to put the RPM lever back to taxi. You might also try to brake. Edit: And don't forget to use reverse power after touch down.

Edited March 20, 2013 by mariodonick

[Chuckfops]

Are you even referring to the same aircraft?

 

This aircraft does not come with a 19+ page manual. And the engines run fine. It's the amount of thrust they provide at idle, or an inertia issue.

 

I'm glad what works on your Jetstream works for you. But this is in the Javelin MK-20 area of the support forum.

 

And your saying, that I should set the thrusters to 0% and brake on landing? Your just insulting my intelligence now.

 

Edit: And don't forget to use reverse power after touch down.

 

More confirmation you are discussing the wrong aircraft, as this one does not have reverse thrusters. I may be new to X-Plane, but I am not new to flight simulation. If  you wish, purchase this perfect aircraft and see what your results are, then get back to me.

 

[Mario Donick]

Are you even referring to the same aircraft?

 

This aircraft does not come with a 19+ page manual. And the engines run fine. It's the amount of thrust they provide at idle, or an inertia issue.

 

I'm glad what works on your Jetstream works for you. But this is in the Javelin MK-20 area of the support forum.

 

And your saying, that I should set the thrusters to 0% and brake on landing? Your just insulting my intelligence now.

 

 

 

More confirmation you are discussing the wrong aircraft, as this one does not have reverse thrusters. I may be new to X-Plane, but I am not new to flight simulation. If  you wish, purchase this perfect aircraft and see what your results are, then get back to me.

 

 

Okay -- that was really stupid of me -- I was referring to JRollons Jetstream 32.  Which again proves the German saying "Wer lesen kann, ist klar im Vorteil."  ("Who's able to read is clearly in advantage.")

 

Well. Can't help you then, sry.

 

 

Edit: Despite being obviously not as intelligent as you (sorry for insulting your intelligence by making a mistake), your SLIGHTLY arrogant attitude in your postings might not convince many people trying to help you.

Edited March 20, 2013 by mariodonick

[Chuckfops]

I don't want help. There is none to have. Not from the people it should be coming from. That is my point.

 

I deeply thank you for wanting to help me. =)        But in this case, it's time for someone to clean up their own mess.

[Mario Donick]

Here's another try:

 

I remember that, when X-Plane 10 was still new, some people complained about the hydraulic pressure lights of older (v9) planes constantly turned on (see, for example, http://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?showtopic=57311 ). The reason was that in XP10 the hydraulic system was changed, and obviously old planes would require updates for that. Many planes are still not updated, though.

 

Now I checked about the Javelin. It was apparently made for XP 9.1, which is really old (and that's also why it is of course 64 bit compatible -- it probably does not use any plugins, which became common much later). So although most of it will run, it's not a surprise that some things may not work as intended anymore. It may well be that also the other issues you mention may be related to its age. Maybe a bigger update is required. But if that makes sense economically must be decided by Javier.

[Cameron]

So there we go. I guess the warning light sticking on is more our problem(the consumer) than theirs(the creator).
 
I guess it is nothing to worry about. lol!

 

You misunderstood.

 

The Javelin has no plug-ins. All systems are 100% controlled by Laminar/X-Plane itself. This was also explained to you in an e-mail. As Javier is also a part of the Laminar team I am sure he too will dig a bit deeper into this and get with the creators to find a solution on the light itself. Other than this, I can not find other affected areas of flight.

 

I personally just test flew this aircraft between two points in X-Plane 10.2 without a hitch, both during takeoff and landing. Stopping was easily had with the assistance of breaks.

 

As Javier has already explained to you in an e-mail, please also be sure to double check that your flight model per second setting in X-Plane is at 2 or higher.

[Japo32]

Yes.. when I have a little of time I will see this issue. Right now I cannot because fully working for Laminar like hell. But will take a look in future. 

But as said.. this light wouldn't affect at all the normal operations with the Javelin.

The Javelin has no switch to turn on/off the hydraulics, they are automatically on.

[Chuckfops]

It looks to me, like we have a different opinion on what the term compatible means.

 

com·pat·i·ble

 

 

adjective

1.

capable of existing or living together in harmony: the most compatible married couple I know.

 

2.

able to exist together with something else: Prejudice is not compatible with true religion.

 

3.

consistent; congruous (often followed by with  ): His claims are not compatible with the facts.

 

4.

Computers.

a.

(of software) capable of being run on another computer without change.

 

b.

(of hardware) capable of being connected to another device without the use of special equipment or software.

 

 

 

5.

Electronics. (of a device, signal, etc.) capable of being used with equipment in a system without the need for special modification or conversion.

 

 

Can we agree that maybe the hydraulic pressure light being on all the time may not fit under this definition completely 100%? But I assure you, the airfoils needing updated in airfoil maker does fall under the category of a special modification or conversion..

 

I can agree to disagree here, but at least you guys have finally claimed that the issue is fact. And not just the users error. Maybe some of my expectations are a bit high. But in your return email, you told me that it will run perfectly. Again, I must have a different opinion on the meaning of the word perfect also.

 

If this plane is for XP 9.1, maybe it should stay there. Until these issues are ironed out.  At least give your customers more of a heads up on what the correct requirements and expectations are, and more of what they should expect. It would appear less shady like this.

 

Congrats on your job with Laminar btw.

It would be very neat to work in an area that you clearly love so much. Just show your planes some update loving too please. At least update the dang airfoils for them.I am confident there will be more FSX users making their way over to X-plane. And they might find themselves, just as bewildered as I am by some of these out of date products, that you still find for sale here in this community. I dunno, maybe the community standards are just lower over here.

 

If the milk turns out to be sour, I ain't the kind of pussy to drink it.

[Chuckfops]

I forgot to thank you for that link and your input Mario. It does help shed some light onto this subject.

 

I think I have to agree with Aubrey in that thread, where they say:

 

"This may be because the aircraft you're using haven't been updated to XP10 format properly. The Hydraulic datarefs changed in XP10, so some XP9 aircraft will show warning lights. I had this exact same problem with my MD-902. Try a few different aircraft, or ask the aircraft authors to update them accordingly. Hope this helps."

 

In this case, it isn't that the aircraft is not updated properly, but more of, not at all. Just wished I would of known, before making the purchase. v10.20 64bit compatible, just meant something else to me entirely.   

[Mario Donick]

If the milk turns out to be sour, I ain't the kind of pussy to drink it.

 

But you for sure act like one

 

 

X-Plane is not FSX -- and this is also true when it comes to development. Most developers here are single persons, without a big budget, completely unlike some of the companies you might be used to from FSX. Also, X-Plane has always been and will always be a platform in constant change, and this also includes broken addon products from time to time -- until these small teams find the time to fix it.

 

Take Carenado, for example. They are well known in FSX, too. But afaik there is only one guy who's doing the X-Plane versions of their planes. And this means: Completely re-developing each plane, except some parts of the visuals. So now one could be angry with Carenado that nearly their complete XP fleet does not work correctly in XP 10.20 atm -- and don't we have every right to be angry? We paid for it, right? We can EXPECT to get these updates ASAP, can't we? Maybe. From a purely verbatim understanding of "customer" and "company" that might be true, as are your dictionary definitions.

 

But that would fail to see where XP is currently. Small developers, often single persons, with multiple projects -- but a community that is very much able to help each other out. Sometimes reminds me a bit of Linux, instead of Windows.

 

Okay, maybe that (my) complete posting should be moved to the RANT board.

Edited March 20, 2013 by mariodonick

[Cameron]

I forgot to thank you for that link and your input Mario. It does help shed some light onto this subject.

 

I think I have to agree with Aubrey in that thread, where they say:

 

"This may be because the aircraft you're using haven't been updated to XP10 format properly. The Hydraulic datarefs changed in XP10, so some XP9 aircraft will show warning lights. I had this exact same problem with my MD-902. Try a few different aircraft, or ask the aircraft authors to update them accordingly. Hope this helps."

 

In this case, it isn't that the aircraft is not updated properly, but more of, not at all. Just wished I would of known, before making the purchase. v10.20 64bit compatible, just meant something else to me entirely.

Chuck,

Aubrey's explanation does not apply here. This would be valid in a modified aircraft that does not utilize default systems entirely, and instead relies on datarefs for objects to show what systems may fail. In the instance of the Javelin, it relies 100% on X-Plane's systems calculations without the use of any datarefs in the cockpit, and as such the explanation in full does not apply to the Javelin. For his aircraft it did, as it was built differently.

Theoretically, since we have no control of the systems, these items are all controlled by the sim itself. This is why updating traditionally does not need to be done.

Re: Airfoils...

I apologize for this. This was a small oversight, and while you're making a huge deal about it, I would have been happy to assist you there and correct the version on the server to no longer need this conversion (we did this for all aircraft a while ago, but a database change was not made on the Javelin by mistake). It's obviously not been a big enough issue from others to comment on, and as our testing has already had these converted it was an easy miss, though unfortunate. You know by now that converting those airfoils takes a mere less than one minute to fix, and had you had problems figuring that out, again, we would have either assisted you in learning to do so or corrected the issue ourselves and provided you a new download.

Your issue now primarily revolves around a light that has zero significance to flight. It affects nothing, the aircraft flies, other than it being displayed. If it bothers you so much we can provide you a version with the light dismissed entirely until Laminar (the creator of the systems) and Javier work on a fix free of charge.

[Chuckfops]

But you for sure act like one

 

I'm going to let that one slide.

 

I'm learning this all very quickly. But I don't think Carenado is replying to emails telling potential customers that their aircraft is 10.20 64bit right now, feel safe with your purchase. And at the very least, they are in the works of fixing it. And their customers can see that light at the end of the tunnel. And when they purchased their aircraft, they knew what version it was for.

 

This small team has known about these issues now for almost 2 years. So that should be plenty of time to update 1 aircraft. Or pull it off the shelves I say. Hold themselves to a higher standard. I understand he is busy right now, with work. But I was raised in a house, where we were not allowed any excuses. And if one of us said we were hungry enough to eat a horse. You better believe someone would be grabbing a fork, a knife, and a horse for us to prove it.

 

Rant away brother, god knows I do. hah.

[Cameron]

This small team has known about these issues now for almost 2 years.

 

Untrue. Anything that may be seen elsewhere would be fixed, and items do adjust over time. This is the first time I am even hearing about this...that's how incorrect you are to assume I have known about this for "2 years".

The track record we have, as well as the products this very same developer produces show his dedication to the community, and that your assertions do not align with fact. You are definitely jumping the gun.

I'll redirect you to the olive branch already extended to you in post 13, and the fact that Javier has already stated his commitment to this subject in post 9.

This will conclude this topic. We'll be absolutely happy to assist you in the already ongoing dialog via e-mail, Chuck. Otherwise, this topic can do without the food fight.

[Japo32]

An update of the plane is sent to x-aviation, but if you want to do it by yourself, open the plane in planemaker xplane10. Go to systems and general2 tab. In hydraulic Sources left pannel click the two electric hydraulic pumps system A/B and the 4 engine-driven hydraulic pump system A/B. Leave the max pressure as it is.

That will make your failure hydraulic system disappear. As said no hydraulics are needed for control surfaces because are wired ones.

[pryoski]

LOL, I'm guessing Chuckfops that you're the same person as Launchpad McQuack ... http://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?showtopic=66315#entry722961

 

I don't see any 'evidence' (as in factual data based observations) on the ORG post you made, just a lot of subjective hyperbole.

It's sounding like you're on a crusade; in light of the fact that the solution has been provided.

 

 

 

 

[Japo32]

Well.. as said, I received 2 more emails from this guy that menaced telling everyone in "all simulations forums" how bad is the product etc etc... 

I don't like the people that starts to flood emails or forums just because they are unsatisphiced with a product. Sent several emails complaining is not going to make a better reply from me. A simple email always has a reply.. and a solution after a time.. as it is demostrated the hydroulic issue is solved... but that was an issue that was not important to fly the plane. What I tried to say to this person is that he could continue flying with it don't waiting for the fix of it... but of course the fix would come. I think I had to say that last thing more clearly. Of course I didn't reply him after the 2 email menaces he made. It is not good to put in line what I said to him privatelly... but put all information.

 

as said.. an smile do more than a menace.