1.18 TBM X-Plane shutdown

[Gregg Seipp]

I had X-Plane shut down on me.  I was flying from KPIE to KTPA climbing through 24000 and I noticed I had AI popping up and disappearing all over my MFD and I didn't want to deal with it.  I'd seen that on my first flight on the ground, airplanes just popping up on the ground and disappearing only to reappear a few seconds later.  II'm not sure why it was doing that.  It's only done that with the TBM so far...my first flight with 1.17.  This is now my third flight.

Anyway, I decided to load up WT3 since, why not?  Maybe that AI stuff would stop.  I loaded it up, it set up the flights and then, a few seconds later, X-Plane disappeared.  *Sigh.*  Checked the logs but there's no indication of a CTD or any problem at all.  I've started WT3 mid-flight with other airplanes...never had an issue.  

I don't use terrain on the PFD and I haven't used rain effect unless it's on by default.  

So there's two issues:

• Why the AI popping in and out (X-Plane doesn't do this with other aircraft)
• Why the shutdown

I've been flying X-plane for a few months now.  Started with a clean machine.  Never had a CTD or shutdown before today.  *Sigh*
 

Edited March 28, 2019 by Gregg Seipp

[Goran_M]

Is WT3 a plug in that loads through the plugins folder of X-Plane?  If it is, it doesnt matter if you have it turned on or not, it will load with the sim, since everything that is in the plugins folder loads when X-Plane loads.  Disabling it doesn't prevent it from loading.  If all the above is what is happening, it's likely this is the cause of your AI flickering on the MFD.  I don't have this issue as I don't have WT3 installed.

Regarding the CTD, other people have reported CTD's when running the TBM with WT3.  The only thing I can think of is to mention it to the WT3 devs.  

Regarding the *sigh*...I said that every.single.time someone said they were getting CTD's on load up of the sim, only for me to reply to countless people to update their grossly outdated GPU drivers.  It got so bad, I had to make a separate post on it.

We're doing our best with the support, Greg.  But the CTD's are not always the TBM's fault.  Even though it may appear that way. 
The TBM will run flawlessly on a clean install of X-Plane.  I know this because one of my X-Plane installs is bare X-Plane with default scenery, that is used as a test bed for early builds.  The more plugins a user installs, the greater the risk of a crash.  

I apologize if it's frustrating for you, but like I said, we're doing our best to get these issues straightened out.  Even though it's a small percentage of people getting them

[Gregg Seipp]

43 minutes ago, Goran_M said:

Is WT3 a plug in that loads through the plugins folder of X-Plane?  If it is, it doesnt matter if you have it turned on or not, it will load with the sim, since everything that is in the plugins folder loads when X-Plane loads.  Disabling it doesn't prevent it from loading.  If all the above is what is happening, it's likely this is the cause of your AI flickering on the MFD.  I don't have this issue as I don't have WT3 installed.

Yes, WT3 loads through plugins.  I wonder if there should be an approved list of plugins somewhere or, perhaps, a list of known incompatible ones.  I hope it doesn't come off as harsh but one does wonder what the TBM is doing that the Zibo, FF A320, Epic E1000 and others aren't doing that makes it so challenging to use fairly ordinary plugins (no LUA...nothing exotic), scenery, and drivers.  I'm supposing that I may have to have a separate install for it.  I hope you'll pardon my sighs.

I will say this...I sat there staring at my desk trying to figure out if I wanted to reload the flight again or just give up for the night.  After a while, I decided to try again so I restarted the flight where the sim exited and continued to Jacksonville.  No flashing AI this time.  It was gorgeous, just after sunset, flying in that planes with all the sounds and the lights below, slowing down onto a visual approach runway 8.  It was magnificent...just beautiful.  Now, if I can just get it consistent.

[Goran_M]

The way the TBM is working, is if a plugin is working WITH the TBM, the TBM will reveal a bug or bugs in that plugin by "exploiting" (for want of a better word) any holes it may have.  There is a ton of customization in the TBM, that will even test X-Plane itself.  In a perfect sim world, everything will work with everything and not cause a crash.  

I think I mentioned in an earlier post the dilemma we had with the Saab crashing when xEnviro was running.  Well it turned out it wasn't the Saab crashing.  It was xEnviro crashing due to something the Saab was doing with xEnviro.  Naturally, because this was only happening with the Saab, everyone assumed it was the Saab's fault.  No other add on was crashing with xEnviro.  After some poking at the XE devs, Andrey reluctantly agreed to look into it and found it was definitely XE crashing due to a bug in his code that the Saab was exploiting.  

That's why we ask people to remove all plugins and then replace them one at a time, so we can see what plugin is doing it, then we can investigate further.

Anyway, I'm rambling on.  

Bottom line, it's not always the aircraft crashing.  Most of the time, it's something a plugin is doing with the aircraft and the aircraft is causing the plugin to crash.  

We'll nail all the issues eventually.  But sometimes it's the other devs who need to make the fixes.

[Gregg Seipp]

4 hours ago, Goran_M said:

I think I mentioned in an earlier post the dilemma we had with the Saab crashing when xEnviro was running.  Well it turned out it wasn't the Saab crashing.  It was xEnviro crashing due to something the Saab was doing with xEnviro.  Naturally, because this was only happening with the Saab, everyone assumed it was the Saab's fault.  No other add on was crashing with xEnviro.  After some poking at the XE devs, Andrey reluctantly agreed to look into it and found it was definitely XE crashing due to a bug in his code that the Saab was exploiting.  

Yes, I remember that post.  I'll work on my plugin set as you have suggested.  For the record, this is the currently installed set of plugins on my sim:

• XCamera*
• Headshake*
• X-ATC-Chatter*
• Active Sky (it has a plugin component)*
• XSaitekPanels*
• StopZoomingDammit*
• World Traffic 3*
• TerrainRadar
• XChecklist
• BetterPushback
• AviTab
• AutoGate
• DataRefTool

I don't use XEnviro, any shader tools nor any enhanced clouds.  The * items are the ones I've actively used with the TBM.  (I recognize they're all loaded if I have them installed.)The bolded ones are the ones I consider essential to having a good experience with the TBM.  I also use ortho and downloaded airports (from x-plane.org, mostly).  The ortho is all on separate drives.  I don't use FlyWithLUA.  I also haven't used rain effects nor terrain on the PFD so far.  I don't use ATC.

My sim is an X-Plane 11.30, i7-8700 32 gig, GTX1070 8 gig, a few SSDs, 4K monitor, CH Yoke, CH Throttle, Saitek pedals and one Saitek panel.  My settings are fairly low, (no reflections, 2xFXAA) my video memory is never close to fully used.  My framerates with the TBM is typically in the upper 30s.  It's stable as a boulder.

 

Edited March 29, 2019 by Gregg Seipp

[Gregg Seipp]

Is it possible that the TBM is, somehow, forcing default AI on?

[ChefRob]

2 hours ago, Gregg Seipp said:

Is it possible that the TBM is, somehow, forcing default AI on?

I don't think by it's self... Has to be either a lua. script doing something of WT3 and how it's setup. I  run WT3 and the only plugin have that you are running is HeadShake, I don't have AI popping up unless I turn on WT3.

Can you do a short flight see if you can get it to happen again? Post the log from it... Can't hurt

[Gregg Seipp]

3 minutes ago, ChefRob said:

I don't think by it's self... Has to be either a lua. script doing something of WT3 and how it's setup. I  run WT3 and the only plugin have that you are running is HeadShake, I don't have AI popping up unless I turn on WT3.

Can you do a short flight see if you can get it to happen again? Post the log from it... Can't hurt

Maybe tomorrow.  I have had it happen twice (out of three flights)...not sure what the logs would say.  I don't use any LUA.  BTW, today I've taken two flights...no popping airplanes and everything's very stable.  Kinda lonely tho.

[Gregg Seipp]

I took about 8 flights since that shut down...no problems since.  Yes, it'd be nice to have WT3 back but this is one crazy addictive plane to fly nonetheless.  I only wish it was a twin so I could fly it over open water.

Gregg

[Goran_M]

 

[Gregg Seipp]

1 hour ago, Goran_M said:

 

Okay, so we need a life raft...and heated seats.  Speaking of which, wouldn't a cargo version of this plane be nice.  Removable seats?  The soft glow of the G1000 around the cabin at night and screen glare.