Gildahl

Thanks folks. I have my answer.

In the original threads on the issue, I think we concluded (or suspected) that the issue was most noticeable in higher res headsets.

On my Index, it is immediately obvious by just turning on low visibility and sitting on the runway. Stock fog, on the other hand is perfectly fine.

I actually had two issues in v4 that seemed separate from one another. One was the rotating clouds issue, which was clear at altitudes when flying near or in cumulous clouds. I'm glad to see that that appears to be fixed. The second issue, however, and possibly the greater of the two for me was related to low visibility conditions on or near the ground in which there was fog. The problem was that within the fog there would be banding effects, like posterization, associated with distance, but which led to serious eye convergence issues. For example (and I recall posting some screenshots of this), one might see a building or part of the scenery more heavily obscured by fog in the left eye than the right eye, and when rotating the head the line that separated these two levels of obscuration would shift (though not appearing rotational). These convergence issues were very pronounced and made fog effects unusable in my Index (I think there was a recommended mitigation that I tried, but it only helped slightly). So while happy that the rotating clouds issue was addressed, I'm particularly interested in hearing from anyone who had the low visibility/fog banding issue in v4, commenting on whether that is fixed in v5.

Ok, I'll keep my eyes out for further reports with people expressly indicating that they have shadows turned off.

Same question here. I purchased V4 for VR and was never able to put to any serious use. Between the rotating clouds and (most significantly) the eye convergence in foggy conditions I ultimately put it on the shelf to wait for a fix. The effect was extremely obvious, even just sitting on the runway in foggy conditions. For me, I was told that the developers didn't have an Index to test this in. So I'd love if a user who had been experiencing these two issues in VR before could report on what things look like now. [Edit] Just read the post here, which probably answers my question. So will be holding off for now as this was precisely one of my most major issues...

Ok, thanks for being up-front with this. I'll wait for reports--though something like a time-limited demo of the software would be preferable since user opinions on this sort of thing are sure to be subjective.

This looks very exciting, and since I'm a full-time VR user seeing that the rotating cloud issue has been solved is particularly good to see. At the top of my list, however, is to know whether the convergence issues in low visibility/fog has been solved in VR. This was the #1 reason why I ended up uninstalling v4, since under these conditions it was basically unusable on my Index due to the double vision effect--and while I think the $20 charge for this is completely fair, I wouldn't want to purchase unless this issue has been solved. Since cumulous clouds are the focus of this release, I'm thinking probably not, but please let me know if it is.

Well I hadn't tried this since my posts back in June. Just tried again with real world weather (Fitchburg Airport in MA-where it is currently "stormy") and immediately saw the double-vision overcast skies just sitting on the runway, and clearly unplayable after a quick take-off. That test lasted a grand total of 1 minute and that was enough. Uninstalling again. (Valve Index, SkyMaxx Pro v4.9.6.2, 2080Ti, i9).

You had mentioned this before, and yes, I had tried setting it to max, but didn't fix the problem (as I recall, density between bands was a bit more graduated, but still clearly visible).

I'm glad you are able to see the rotating cloud particles. That is certainly one of the fundamental issues. As far as the convergence issues, I *suspect* it has similar roots. I tried to document this in a picture on the last version's release thread while flying over Boston. When flying in foggy conditions, for example, I find the fog (not always, but sometimes) non-continuous, meaning that there is banding such that the fog density increases with distance in steps. Like the "cloud particles" these "bands" rotate with the rotation of my head and more critically, the left and right eyes see these bands in different positions. The way I *think* this leads to what I call a "convergence" issue is that (as shown in my picture), you might have a building that appears in the left eye as shrouded in a dense layer of fog, but because of the rotating density banding, the right eye might simultaneously be seeing the building much more clearly (for example, if I paused the simulator and then blinked my eyes back and forth, left to right, I could see the building as alternately in the fog and out of the fog). Thus, even if the parallax of the building is correct, the competing fog density differences in right vs left eyes make the brain cry foul and makes it nearly impossible to focus.

Just tried some more testing. Turned real weather off, turned procedural on, set low visibility and just sitting on the runway I could see the issue immediately. So even without real weather, it can be quite serious. Anyway, I've uninstalled SMP again and will try again with the next rev. as it remains too distracting for general use.

Thanks! I guess we really need you to see this...and once you do, I think you'll agree its unmistakable. From this thread, I guess we can at least say it occurs with OG Vive, Pimax, and Index and that higher resolutions make it that much more obvious. Also, keep in mind that many cloud formations do not exhibit this issue at all. For example, I flew for about 15 minutes in the Tetons yesterday (using real weather) in and around heavy cumulus clouds including ones with dark underbellies completely convinced that beta 11 had totally fixed the problem..no convergence or "head turning" issues at all. I was actually pretty excited about that. But then I flew into a canyon that was exhibiting more of an overcast/foggy texture and as I approached the convergence (just in that area) got worse and worse, and along with that, the "head-turning" issue too (i.e. where turning my head back and forth causes pieces of clouds and fog bands to rotate weirdly in place). So it definitely seems like just one specific kind (or class) of cloud texture that is doing this.

Hey Jonnti46, have you tried b11 yet? I just tried it, and at first blush it seems that LR may have done something to improve this. My testing under overcast skies has been too limited to be completely sure, but give it a try and see if it makes a difference for you. [Edit] Not fixed. I just took a flight in the Tetons using real weather (which included some dark overcast type cumulus) and I'm back to the serious head-turning weirdness. Oh well. :-(

I'm on Valve Index. I doubt its a setting since I was able to duplicate on vanilla XP. In the other thread where this was discussed, the developer and I theorized that maybe it was due to the Vive Pro he was using. While I don't know about the Pro (since I don't have one), I tried testing using my old original Vive and I can at least say that the problem is unquestionably less noticeable--I think, because the resolution is so bad that the eyes don't find it hard to converge the big gray blobs. Still, when approaching the ground in fog, even on the OG Vive it is still easy to see the "mirage" effect and the banding that rotates when I rotate my head (easiest to evaluate if you pause the simulator). On the Index, however, its a more serious story, since there is enough cloud detail for the eyes to want to converge--and when they can't it makes me go cross-eyed. It's interesting that you were able to use VR without these issues on an earlier version of XP/SMP In 11.50, I've tried in both Vulkan and OpenGL, so I don't think its the graphics API--and I know that I don't have any of these issues with the standard XP clouds and fog.