Pils Posted October 17 Report Share Posted October 17 2 hours ago, Matchstick said: Patience is not an infinite virtue, especially if someone feels it is being taken advantage of. The developer isn’t sitting on their hands. It’s being worked on on a daily basis. It’ll come when it’s ready. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matchstick Posted October 17 Report Share Posted October 17 7 minutes ago, Pils said: The developer isn’t sitting on their hands. It’s being worked on on a daily basis. It’ll come when it’s ready. I'm honestly at a stage where I would like more information on how the development progressing than a bland assertion. I'm not asking for a release, I'm not asking for a release date but I would like some actual idea of where in the development process the project is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameron Posted October 18 Report Share Posted October 18 6 hours ago, Matchstick said: I'm not asking for a release, I'm not asking for a release date but I would like some actual idea of where in the development process the project is. We're not ready to share that. When we are, you'll know! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eafb Posted October 19 Report Share Posted October 19 On 10/16/2023 at 7:15 PM, Pils said: When there’s something to mention about progress it’ll be mentioned next time someone asks. Lately, I've changed my perspective regarding addon developers (aircraft, scenery, etc.). Today, unlike before, I realize it's not possible to sustain oneself solely on the financial returns generated by this work, due to various factors, one of them being the fact that flight simulation is a niche. There aren't many people engaged in this activity, and even fewer are willing to spend money on an addon, as many believe that upon acquiring the simulator, they should already have access to everything. In summary, I might be wrong, but I see development more as a paid hobby than a job that provides a constant income. That's why I don't think it's fair to question or pressure developers with inquiries like "When will it be ready?" or "It's taking too long...", especially when updates are free. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VirtualGAaviator Posted October 20 Report Share Posted October 20 13 hours ago, eafb said: Lately, I've changed my perspective regarding addon developers (aircraft, scenery, etc.). Yup. There was a time when I felt a sense of entitlement. When I purchased an add-on, the developer owed it to me to be at my beck and call, to answer my every whim. After all, I demonstrated my trust in your product by giving you my hard-earned money while at the same time having a distrust of you. In my mind, you were some big software development company, making millions. Additionally, software development has virtually no overhead, so it's all profit for you. You, Microsoft, and Google have the same agenda - to make as much money as God. I engaged in YouTube, poked around flight sim forums, and learned that most flight sim developers are me. They are someone who's grown to love aviation and flight simulation. The difference is that they have software development skills. Many don't earn a profit and suffer abuse from the entitled me. Those that do earn profit have often spent years developing its add-on. I've learned that aircraft add-ons development has become almost too complex and complicated for a single person to make a high-end airplane. It often requires some collaboration and contributions from devs with strong skills in special areas. I can see how this collaboration can slow down development and even introduce beetles and roaches that have to be squashed. Even with some inclination of what devs go through, buggy releases are frustrating. I'd rather wait for a decent release that an aircraft that simply sits in my virtual hanger. Hot Start, AFAIK, builds highly customized add-ons. The systems go deeper than average and given how radically different parts of X-Pane 12 is from X-Plane 11, a lot of stuff apparently has to be changed in the TBM900. Exactly what, is above my pay grade but I believe Cameron, Pils and the developer when they say it's being worked on. Again, patience is a virtue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eafb Posted October 20 Report Share Posted October 20 1 hour ago, VirtualGAaviator said: Yup. There was a time when I felt a sense of entitlement. When I purchased an add-on, the developer owed it to me to be at my beck and call, to answer my every whim. After all, I demonstrated my trust in your product by giving you my hard-earned money while at the same time having a distrust of you. In my mind, you were some big software development company, making millions. Additionally, software development has virtually no overhead, so it's all profit for you. You, Microsoft, and Google have the same agenda - to make as much money as God. I engaged in YouTube, poked around flight sim forums, and learned that most flight sim developers are me. They are someone who's grown to love aviation and flight simulation. The difference is that they have software development skills. Many don't earn a profit and suffer abuse from the entitled me. Those that do earn profit have often spent years developing its add-on. I've learned that aircraft add-ons development has become almost too complex and complicated for a single person to make a high-end airplane. It often requires some collaboration and contributions from devs with strong skills in special areas. I can see how this collaboration can slow down development and even introduce beetles and roaches that have to be squashed. Even with some inclination of what devs go through, buggy releases are frustrating. I'd rather wait for a decent release that an aircraft that simply sits in my virtual hanger. Hot Start, AFAIK, builds highly customized add-ons. The systems go deeper than average and given how radically different parts of X-Pane 12 is from X-Plane 11, a lot of stuff apparently has to be changed in the TBM900. Exactly what, is above my pay grade but I believe Cameron, Pils and the developer when they say it's being worked on. Again, patience is a virtue. Exactly. I can't wait to have the TBM900 in XP12. I even thought about getting the TBM850 for FS2020, but honestly, I got tired of it just by watching videos of people who bought it. Besides, I'm not a big fan of FS2020... (maybe prejudice... I don't know...), but until the TBM arrives, I'm in good company with the CL650 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goran_M Posted October 23 Report Share Posted October 23 On 10/18/2023 at 2:52 AM, Matchstick said: Patience is not an infinite virtue, especially if someone feels it is being taken advantage of. No one's patience is being taken advantage of. We're doing the best we can, and working as fast as we can, so we can get started on the next project. But things need to be done properly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matchstick Posted October 24 Report Share Posted October 24 On 10/23/2023 at 2:44 AM, Goran_M said: No one's patience is being taken advantage of. We're doing the best we can, and working as fast as we can, so we can get started on the next project. But things need to be done properly. The issue isn't the time that's being taken. The issue is the refusal to talk to customers about what stage the project has got to (and I use "refusal" deliberately there). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sqrt(-1) Posted October 24 Report Share Posted October 24 8 hours ago, Matchstick said: The issue is the refusal to talk to customers about what stage the project has got to (and I use "refusal" deliberately there). The more time the developers spend talking about where they are in development, the less time is spent developing... Where do you suppose they should draw the line. Personally, I prefer to let them work without constant distraction so the product ultimately gets done quicker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goran_M Posted October 25 Report Share Posted October 25 16 hours ago, Matchstick said: The issue isn't the time that's being taken. The issue is the refusal to talk to customers about what stage the project has got to (and I use "refusal" deliberately there). We refuse to post specifics in public, because many times what we plan to do, never makes it to the final product. Then we have to deal with, "But they said they were going to do it! What happened?". And the reason can be 1 of many. If you really want to know what we're currently up to, I can give you that. Due to the changes made in XP12's engine model, Saso continues to work on "libturbine". He's also adding a few "extras". And me, I'm juggling 650, TBM and DC3 update work. The TBM is getting some polish on the 3D, textures and animations. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matchstick Posted October 25 Report Share Posted October 25 (edited) 7 hours ago, Goran_M said: We refuse to post specifics in public, because many times what we plan to do, never makes it to the final product. Then we have to deal with, "But they said they were going to do it! What happened?". And the reason can be 1 of many. If you really want to know what we're currently up to, I can give you that. Due to the changes made in XP12's engine model, Saso continues to work on "libturbine". He's also adding a few "extras". And me, I'm juggling 650, TBM and DC3 update work. The TBM is getting some polish on the 3D, textures and animations. That's the sort of thing I've been asking for for about 6 month now. Thank you. Are systems/avionics, flight model and sound expected to require substantial work once turbine and 3d models are more complete ? Edited October 25 by Matchstick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goran_M Posted October 25 Report Share Posted October 25 7 hours ago, Matchstick said: Are systems/avionics, flight model and sound expected to require substantial work once turbine and 3d models are more complete ? Yet to be determined how substantial. But yes to at least some of those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matchstick Posted October 26 Report Share Posted October 26 10 hours ago, Goran_M said: Yet to be determined how substantial. But yes to at least some of those. Thank you for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkbard2 Posted October 28 Report Share Posted October 28 On 10/16/2023 at 6:14 PM, Pils said: If you’re happy with a cheap knockoff then more power to you. Hi....im curious as to why you refer to it as a cheap knockoff. Seems like a quality offering to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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