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Graeme_77

[SOLVED] Frame Rates / Objects size

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I’ve got a relatively old PC, I5-2500 and a 1GB HD6850 Graphics Card - and I know it’s probably well below what the developers had in mind when they developed the TBM so this isn’t a criticism of the product.

However, I’m getting frame rates of less than 12 with the TBM, compared with 35 on the IXEG 737 with otherwise identical settings. I had a look in the objects folder and the objects are huge, the largest obj is 45MB for a glareshield.

In total the IXEG objects are 56.5MB, with the TBM at 327MB - so I’m guessing this is where the frame rate hit is coming from. Changing the forward view to the X-Plane default HUD view restores the frame rates to 35-40.

Before I commit $2500 to a new PC can I ask is any optimisation of the model planned?

Thanks, Graeme

Edited by skiselkov

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Hello, well what can I say: this is maybe the most advanced product for any civil flight simulator now days! Really what an aircraft!

But yes indeed, the FPS impact is huge. XP just stopped working after 5min because of low FPS. 

All plugins not really needed were turn off. xEnviro was also OFF but unfortunately the TBM is unflyable on my I-7 2700k @ 4.2Ghz, GTX1070..

I'm convinced that this product has a huge potential and I'm frustrated to not be able to fly it this weekend.

Anyway, Good job to the developer I can just imagine what a time consuming project it is.

 

Cheers,

 

Edited by Skyguider
CPU update

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OK, actually I was able to make it run only once (the very first time with the presentation) after it crashed I'm not able to load it in XP anymore.

I think the team has some hard work to do now so good luck guys with fighting the CDT issue.

We are all crossing the fingers!

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I have a quite simple system (i7-6500U, up to 3,1GHz with a GTX 950M) and after reloading the plane and before deleting the preference folder I had 20fps. Enough, to fly it quite smoothly!

 

Edited by Elpromo

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My specs: I5-3550 @3,5GHz, 8GB Ram and GTX1060

IXEG: 35 FPS

FF A320: 28 FPS

FlyJSim 732: 30 FPS

TBM 900: 20 FPS

TBM 900 without any addons or scripts or weather: 25 FPS

TBM 900 without any addons or scripts or weather BUT Synt Terr: 16 FPS :unsure:

 

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3 minutes ago, fehrster said:

My specs: I5-3550 @3,5GHz, 8GB Ram and GTX1060

IXEG: 35 FPS

FF A320: 28 FPS

FlyJSim 732: 30 FPS

TBM 900: 20 FPS

TBM 900 without any addons or scripts or weather: 25 FPS

TBM 900 without any addons or scripts or weather BUT Synt Terr: 16 FPS :unsure:

What texture settings are you running. If your GeForce 1060 is a 3GB VRAM model, that is our minimum and that requires turning down the texture quality to medium. The aircraft comes packed with very high resolution textures.

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19 minutes ago, skiselkov said:

What texture settings are you running. If your GeForce 1060 is a 3GB VRAM model, that is our minimum and that requires turning down the texture quality to medium. The aircraft comes packed with very high resolution textures.

I've got lot less VRAM than that, but even with textures set to low and most of the internal and external textures resized down to 2048 there was no framerate improvement. I think It's all in the 3D model itself. If I go to external view and zoom far away or view forward with no panel the frame rates are fine and the pages like engine parameters are fine.

From the TBM glareshield.obj POINT_COUNTS    470814

From the IXEG fuselage.obj POINT_COUNTS    81633

In the objects folder the IXEG has 137MB of textures vs 149M in the TBM - I don't think that's a huge difference for the GPU, but as I noted initially the TBM OBJ files are 6 times larger than the IXEG.

(I completely understand my system is well below spec, and what I've seen of the system sim is really very good!)

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I can confirm the same, I played with the settings all day but there us no change at all in FPS, no matter what you do with the textures, HDR, pluggins delete etc, I keep them around 13-15fps in clear sky. 

Is there anything to do with the fact that I'm running XP11.25? Should I delete my xp prefs file?

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Im running an I7-8700K, an 1080TI, and running Xplane from SSD, i normally get around 55-60FPS using Zibo, around 45FPS using FF320U, and i get around 40FPS with the TBM, mind you i am using default weather engine for the TBM because i want to use the WX radar, BUT once i turn on Synthetic vision on i drop instantly to 26-29 FPS, why is synth vision having such a huge impact?

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After downloading the update the FPS improved a bit and now I'm around 25fps. I'm not sure if the update is the reason because I delete my XP pref files before trying the new version.

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You could try and resize some textures.

I did, made the sim smooth like butter again. But don't resize normal (NML) files, that might get you into trouble.

I resized the outside textures and some interior textures as well. But not the main panel and other important textures (the ones containing texts and the ones you look at constantly from a pilots perspective). But things like i.e the floor and baggage and so on. You don't see the difference unless you zoom all the way in, so if you're willing to trade off super-duper detail for speed and usability, this is the way to go. And as always, make backups before fiddling with anything so if anything goes awry or you're not happy you can revert to the original files.

I resized most of them to 1024 and the interior seats + pedestal to 2048 just as a test. I might try 2048 for the exterior though.

I used irfanview (freeware) to do the resizing.

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I havea GTX1070 and also getting 13-15 fps constantly. It is a shame, as it makes it hard to enjoy this amazing airplane! 

Is it possible to share these resized files? Id love to try it out and hopefully get a more normal fps 

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15 minutes ago, ramster211 said:

I havea GTX1070 and also getting 13-15 fps constantly. It is a shame, as it makes it hard to enjoy this amazing airplane! 

Is it possible to share these resized files? Id love to try it out and hopefully get a more normal fps 

I had the same issue with the 1070... What has helped: Load first the default C172, then switch to the TBM. Sounds weird, I know.

Had this with other aircrafts  too (e.g. FF 320).

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@skiselkov i will do it once i get the chance to, but i updated my graphics card a few days ago.

 

An optional lower resolution version would be really great and im sure a lot of others would appericate it too 

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1 hour ago, ramster211 said:

I havea GTX1070 and also getting 13-15 fps constantly. It is a shame, as it makes it hard to enjoy this amazing airplane! 

Is it possible to share these resized files? Id love to try it out and hopefully get a more normal fps 

1070 here, solid (locked) 30 FPS at EDDF payware , med/ high settings.  Direct loading into the TBM.

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2 minutes ago, Cebulon said:

1070 here, solid (locked) 30 FPS at EDDF payware , med/ high settings.  Direct loading into the TBM.

Do you mean with resized textures?

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7 hours ago, skiselkov said:

What texture settings are you running. If your GeForce 1060 is a 3GB VRAM model, that is our minimum and that requires turning down the texture quality to medium. The aircraft comes packed with very high resolution textures.

It is a 6gb 1060, textures setting is medium. it makes no difference if high or medium. The graphics card always snoozles at 30%. CPU between 60- 80%. The CPU time is 0.0450 on average and the gpu time on 0.0412. On other planes i have that, when the gpu is running at 100%.

I know, that the cpu is the bottleneck of my PC, but such a big difference to other planes, especially when syntetic vision is on?

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1 hour ago, fehrster said:

I know, that the cpu is the bottleneck of my PC, but such a big difference to other planes, especially when syntetic vision is on?

What sort of CPU are you running?

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1 minute ago, prattpt6 said:

Does the TBM automatically utilize all cores on your CPU?

Yes, the avionics is heavily multi-threaded.

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No matter what I do or how I'm playing with the settings, the TBM 1.0.2 will run around 20fps in CAVOK. If any clouds it will drop bellow and after a while it will be unflyable.

I almost reduced my XP graphics to minimum (textures,effects, AA etc.), world objects as well. 

I even resized the textures in objects by half- there is absolutely no impact or any change.

If I do the same tricks with any other aircraft the fps rate changes from standard to double. I know that my config is old but why such a huge difference compared to other new products out there?

This aircraft is fantastic and definitely the best GA actually (without the baby diseases). I really hope that it will be possible to improve the fps in future updates.

I7- 2700k @3.5-4.2Ghz ovrckd, GTX 1070, 16MB RAM

 

 

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Skyguider your GPU is miles better than mine, but your CPU is of a similar age (I've got an i5-2500k 3.3 with a slight overclock). I've tried all the same things you did and can't get a significant improvement. I don't think it's textures as although they are 4K the total texture size is only around 200MB, My suspicion is it's the size of the obj files that is the issue, and perhaps that's loading the CPU rather than the GPU causing the whole sim to slow down.

The obj files are enormous. 6 times larger than the IXEG, 5 times larger than Felis 154, 3 times larger than the FF A320 and finally only slightly smaller than the Rotate MD-80 which is virtually unusable on XP11 for me - although it ran OK on XP10 - again suggesting perhaps that the CPU load is the problem rather than the GPU. 

Here's a extract from an IXEG object:-

POINT_COUNTS    7222 0 0 28056
VT      -0.7237    0.3741    2.0096    -0.165 -0.439  0.883    0.6316 0.874

and from the TBM:-

POINT_COUNTS    470814    0    0    470814
VT    0.00841901    0.09876074    0.00741016    -0.99862665    0.05215613    -0    0.894862    0.79924899

I don't know how the X-Plane engine works, but the sim appears to be being asked to draw a massive amount of polygons apparently to a higher precision with the TBM model.

I'd be keen to see how your system performs if you swap the forward view to the X-Plane HUD view? For me this instantly doubles the FPS. No textures are unloaded, but the sim simply performs better without the cockpit view hence my suspicion it's the objects themselves. I've also tried pulling the CBs for all the G1000 screens but that has no improvement.

As a last resort, I made a copy of the .acf then removed references to glareshield.obj, seats.obj, cargo.obj and cabin_rear.obj - this improved my FPS from 15 to 18 - a 20% improvement.

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